Why does Chani have red hair?

[A Thing of Eternity]

Chakobsa is NOT Fremen. They're two separate languages. Read the books. Even the McDune idiots get THAT much right.

It's not even a single language, you dolt.

Huh? Two separate languages are not a single language? I guess that's some profound Kabbalistic insight?

I think he/she was trying to say Chakobsa is more than one language.

[SandChigger]

If that was the intention, then trying is the word.

[dar.tar]

As he approached the solitary figure standing near the ornithopter, Leto had studied [Kynes]: tall, thin, dressed for the desert in loose robe, stillsuit, and low boots. The man's hood was thrown back, it's veil hanging to one side, revealing long sandy hair, a sparse beard.

And Pardot Kynes wasn't from Arrakis either. So even if the Fremen generally had a certain coloring, Chani could easily have gotten the red hair from the other side of her family, unless I'm missing something.

[A Thing of Eternity]

As he approached the solitary figure standing near the ornithopter, Leto had studied [Kynes]: tall, thin, dressed for the desert in loose robe, stillsuit, and low boots. The man's hood was thrown back, it's veil hanging to one side, revealing long sandy hair, a sparse beard.

And Pardot Kynes wasn't from Arrakis either. So even if the Fremen generally had a certain coloring, Chani could easily have gotten the red hair from the other side of her family, unless I'm missing something.

The original post mentions this, calling Chani 3/4 Arab (though Arab should have read Fremen). The point was though that red hair (as we see it in Europeans anyways) is a recessive trait, it absolutely MUST come from both sides of the family or you can't have it. Chani would have only had it from one side, unless there was red hair genes in the Fremen gene pool already before Pardot came.

[MrFlibble]

Chani would have only had it from one side, unless there was red hair genes in the Fremen gene pool already before Pardot came.

Is there any reason to believe there weren't?

[A Thing of Eternity]

Chani would have only had it from one side, unless there was red hair genes in the Fremen gene pool already before Pardot came.

Is there any reason to believe there weren't?

No, which is what my earlier posts in this thread argue. This last post I was just pointing out to Dar.Tar that unlike many other traits, red hair cannot come from just one side of the family (again, disclaimer - I know nothing about the redhair gene in Indians and nother dark skinned people, theirs may be entirely seperate and dominant for all I know).

[RedHeadKevin]

If red hair has to come from both sides of the family, who in the Atreides line had red hair for the twins to inherit?
EDIT: It probably came from somewhere in the Corrino branch of the family. The Emperor was a redhead.

As a redhead (Daywalker) myself, I've always felt bad for the redheads on Arrakis. Sunburn like crazy!

[Freakzilla]

If red hair has to come from both sides of the family, who in the Atreides line had red hair for the twins to inherit?
EDIT: It probably came from somewhere in the Corrino branch of the family. The Emperor was a redhead.

As a redhead (Daywalker) myself, I've always felt bad for the redheads on Arrakis. Sunburn like crazy!

You just need a big hat.

[Robspierre]

If red hair has to come from both sides of the family, who in the Atreides line had red hair for the twins to inherit?
EDIT: It probably came from somewhere in the Corrino branch of the family. The Emperor was a redhead.

As a redhead (Daywalker) myself, I've always felt bad for the redheads on Arrakis. Sunburn like crazy!

You just need a big hat.

What have you done with the real Freak?

Rob

[Freakzilla]

I've had hick-ups on and off for like two days, I think I'm losing my mind.

[A Thing of Eternity]

If red hair has to come from both sides of the family, who in the Atreides line had red hair for the twins to inherit?
EDIT: It probably came from somewhere in the Corrino branch of the family. The Emperor was a redhead.

As a redhead (Daywalker) myself, I've always felt bad for the redheads on Arrakis. Sunburn like crazy!

It doesn't have to be recent at all. I have an aunt and uncle that are both dark haired brown eyed Ukrainians, but still produced the normal redhead (fair skin, freckles, green eyes). On one side of their ancestry the red hair was something like 6 generations back if I recall correctly. It can potentially lurk in the gene pool unexpressed for as long as it's luck holds out (given that every child has a 50% chance of not getting the recessive gene passed to them), which could be centuries really.

[SandChigger]

As a redhead (Daywalker) myself, I've always felt bad for the redheads on Arrakis. Sunburn like crazy!

You just need a big hat.

That or... only go out at night.

[A Thing of Eternity]

Being covered completely save your eyes would help too.

Interesting actually, I just realized that FH talked about stillsuits having cooling mechanisms (by wicking away sweat I believe), but also about Fremen going out at night. Deserts are typically cold as shit at night are they not? Maybe I'm just drunk (welll... maybe isn't really the word) but this kinda seems like a possible oversight on FH's behalf.

[merkin muffley]

Being covered completely save your eyes would help too.

Interesting actually, I just realized that FH talked about stillsuits having cooling mechanisms (by wicking away sweat I believe), but also about Fremen going out at night. Deserts are typically cold as shit at night are they not? Maybe I'm just drunk (welll... maybe isn't really the word) but this kinda seems like a possible oversight on FH's behalf.

Fremen travel at night, don't they? It gets cold, but they wouldn't need more than the jubba cloak and stillsuit, would they? I got stoned and wandered into Joshua Tree one summer without a tent, and then froze my fucking ass off that night, miles away from my car. But I probably would've been alright with a jubba cloak.

[A Thing of Eternity]

Being covered completely save your eyes would help too.

Interesting actually, I just realized that FH talked about stillsuits having cooling mechanisms (by wicking away sweat I believe), but also about Fremen going out at night. Deserts are typically cold as shit at night are they not? Maybe I'm just drunk (welll... maybe isn't really the word) but this kinda seems like a possible oversight on FH's behalf.

Fremen travel at night, don't they? It gets cold, but they wouldn't need more than the jubba cloak and stillsuit, would they? I got stoned and wandered into Joshua Tree one summer without a tent, and then froze my fucking ass off that night, miles away from my car. But I probably would've been alright with a jubba cloak.

Fair enough, but I'm pretty sure FH does describe the suits as being cooling, which seems like a deadly bad idea in the desert night. With no water around to maintain temp stability I imagine temps on Dune at night would be terrifyingly cold, we're talking spit freezing cold.

[Freakzilla]

I don't remember him describing the stilsuit as cooling...

[Freakzilla]

"Certainly," Kynes said. He felt up under the robe for the shoulder seals,
speaking as he examined the suit. "It's basically a micro-sandwich--a highefficiency
filter and heat-exchange system." He adjusted the shoulder seals.
"The skin-contact layer's porous. Perspiration passes through it, having cooled
the body . . . near-normal evaporation process. The next two layers . . . "
Kynes tightened the chest fit. ". . . include heat exchange filaments and salt
precipitators. Salt's reclaimed."

Sweat evaporating apparently still cools the skin, but if it wasn't hot enough you wouldn't sweat.

[SandChigger]

Well, they weren't exactly going outside and standing or sitting around stargazing.

Doing their work assignments, going on surveillance and raids... I would imagine that they built up a bit of heat even at night. The main purpose of the stillsuits was to preserve water, no? What cools in the day could well serve to keep them warm at night as well.

[SandRider]

"You must ride the sand in the light of day that Shai-hulud shall see and
know you have no fear," Stilgar had said. "Thus we turn our time around and set
ourselves to sleep this night."

***********************************************************

Paul marked the tone of Stilgar's voice -- half ritual and half that of a
worried friend.
In that instant, the sun seemed to bound above the horizon. The sky took on
the silvered gray-blue that warned this would be a day of extreme heat and
dryness even for Arrakis.
"It is the time of the scalding day," Stilgar said, and now his voice was
entirely ritual. "Go, Usul, and ride the maker, travel the sand as a leader of
men."

[HarryCanyon]

Well Chani is the oddest of the Fremen tribe for being a redhead while others have dark, Brown, grey or white hair. I think she is considered to be the most unlikely and i guess Paul had a thing for redheads.

[Serkanner]

i guess Paul had a thing for redheads.

And you base that on what ... ?

[Freakzilla]

i guess Paul had a thing for redheads.

And you base that on what ... ?

His mom and pederast granddad had red hair so naturally...

[inhuien]

^^^My thoughts exactly.

[SandRider]

me, too ....

which brought up the idea of a german incest version of Dune ...
(them germans love them some incest-porn, go figure ...)

y'all can fill-in the blanks for yourselves ...

[SandChigger]

Now DANTSE, Shprockets! DANTSE for Dieter!