"New Canon" inconsistencies....

SandChigger · Post by **SandChigger** » 25 Feb 2008 12:16

Poor Kevvy. It must be rough being so hated. Good thing he has his talent to comfort him, huh?

Tleilax Master B · Post by **Tleilax Master B** » 25 Feb 2008 13:55

Hehe, yeah, his talents and oodles of not-so-hard-earned $$$$$$$$$$

loremaster · Post by **loremaster** » 26 Feb 2008 14:45

Gas dense enough to keep a human body afloat?

Gas density is a complicated thing, but basically at room T + P you've got no chance of making a gas "dense" enough to support a body. The only hope you'd have of measuring any appreciable "density" in a gas in a container is at high T+ P... or somehow having a molecule with a massive atomic number which ALSO is a gas.... which doesnt happen. Sorry, just doesnt.

Navigators are initially described as human in appearance in dune.... but then initially paul can see them in dune....maybe its Franks inconsistency?

Jessica was out of Tanidia Nerus - Leto, CoD. The rational is that RMM was using an assumed name at the time... which is of course bollocks as leto and jessica would remember this also and call her by her real name.

Why has no-one mentioned the entire of Hunters and Sadworms? The machine threat was CLEARLY ixian hunter-seekers. (ref leto in the desert).

What about everyone forgetting about miles' super speed ability?

There must be more from the Dune 7.8?

Crysknife · Post by **Crysknife** » 26 Feb 2008 16:13

Why has no-one mentioned the entire of Hunters and Sadworms? The machine threat was CLEARLY ixian hunter-seekers. (ref leto in the desert).

Calm down Crys, calm down....

Tleilax Master B · Post by **Tleilax Master B** » 26 Feb 2008 16:14

loremaster wrote:
Gas dense enough to keep a human body afloat?

Gas density is a complicated thing, but basically at room T + P you've got no chance of making a gas "dense" enough to support a body. The only hope you'd have of measuring any appreciable "density" in a gas in a container is at high T+ P... or somehow having a molecule with a massive atomic number which ALSO is a gas.... which doesnt happen. Sorry, just doesnt.

Navigators are initially described as human in appearance in dune.... but then initially paul can see them in dune....maybe its Franks inconsistency?

Jessica was out of Tanidia Nerus - Leto, CoD. The rational is that RMM was using an assumed name at the time... which is of course bollocks as leto and jessica would remember this also and call her by her real name.

Why has no-one mentioned the entire of Hunters and Sadworms? The machine threat was CLEARLY ixian hunter-seekers. (ref leto in the desert).

What about everyone forgetting about miles' super speed ability?

There must be more from the Dune 7.8?

Oh, we are just getting started loremaster. I was working my way up to Sadworms and Grunters.

The machine threat (which would hve been Arafel, according to Leto II) IMO (I know there is still some debate over this) was already prevented by Leto II, so it shouldn't have reared it's ugly head in the sequels. But, alas, those knuckleheads can't keep track of all that stuff Frank wrote, so they made some new shit up.

And Sheeana's and Duncan's severe memory loss in respect to Teg's superspeed was just a plain old fashioned oversight by the new author's and they can't possibly explain that one away. Its a blatant inconsistency, as you have pointed out loremaster.

More on Hunters later, I need to get to my notes to start lambasting it....

Crysknife · Post by **Crysknife** » 26 Feb 2008 16:25

I don't know if this counts, but in Dune, Gurney is a Swordmaster. It never states that he's a Swordmaster "of Ginaz", so I don't know. No reason for this is given in the pre's.

Post by **Freakzilla** » 26 Feb 2008 21:45

Crysknife wrote:I don't know if this counts, but in Dune, Gurney is a Swordmaster. It never states that he's a Swordmaster "of Ginaz", so I don't know. No reason for this is given in the pre's.

Swordmaster is a job, or a profession. Ginaz was was a Great House.

So Duncan, swordmaster of the Ginaz, was once a swordmaster in House Ginaz's employ. They were obviously known for their great swordmasters as they are so prominently mentioned in the Sardaukar entry in Dune's Terms of the Imperium.

Besides, Gurney is refered to as a Swordmaster in Dune:

"Stilgar," he said, "this is Gurney Halleck of whom you've heard me speak.
My father's master-of-arms, one of the swordmasters who instructed me, an old
friend. He can be trusted in any venture."
"I hear," Stilgar said. "You are his Duke."

Crysknife · Post by **Crysknife** » 27 Feb 2008 00:12

Yes, being a swordmaster is a profession, and one that presumably needs much training in a school. It is assumed from Dune that Swordmasters of Ginaz have ten levels, so what would we consider Gurney when it is stated in the originals that Gurney could best Duncan in a match?

"I remember that night well," he said. "I was very young . . .
inexperienced."
"But the best swordmaster in my Duke's retinue."
"Not quite, My Lady. Gurney could best me six times out of ten." He glanced
at her. "Where is Gurney?"

Do we assume Leto would give training to Duncan and not Gurney? And why one at Ginaz, and one elsewhere? Does it make sense that Gurney was rescued after Duncan had already gone to the Ginaz school, or at least around the same time?

I'm just thinking out loud here. Something about the Pre's doesn't add up, but I'm not certain and it's been a long time since I've read them. What are age differences between Gurney and Duncan? IIRC, one is never given.

Duncan was trained at Ginaz, and fought for the Duke on Grumman, presumably in the War of Assassins between the two. Where would Gurney be during all of this? I got the impression that Gurney was older than Duncan, so I would assume that he came to House Atriedes before Duncan, which would have given the Duke plenty of time to send him to Ginaz for training, before that House was destroyed. If not, then how could Gurney ever be better than Duncan who was known for being one of the best, if not THE best swordmaster around? That would mean Gurney would have to learn after Duncan, in less time, and end up over-all better than a Ginaz tenth level Swordmaster. So my thinking is that Gurney is older(and under HA longer) and received training from a school, be it Ginaz or not, and Duncan was hired after his Ginaz training and before Grumman. I'm pretty sure the Pre's have it backward, but I could be wrong.

Am I missing something here?

This is probably more of a complaint than a real inconsistency, but I found it interesting anyway.

The Sons of Idaho · Post by **The Sons of Idaho** » 28 Feb 2008 14:55

Gas dense enough to keep a human body afloat?

*gasp* DAMN...YOU...ARCHEMEDIES!!!

- dying navigator's lament

Simon · Post by **Simon** » 28 Feb 2008 20:54

SandChigger wrote:I hope that's not a case of speaking from experience....

no, thank god! Let's call it common sense

SandChigger · Post by **SandChigger** » 28 Feb 2008 21:24

Rakis · Post by **Rakis** » 28 Feb 2008 21:46

New canon inconsistencies ?

A choice of two words :

1) Scattering surrounded
2) Erasmus Omnius
3) Armored worms
4) Ultra...everything
5) Nice Tlelaxu (WTF ????!?)

Tleilax Master B · Post by **Tleilax Master B** » 28 Feb 2008 22:59

loremaster · Post by **loremaster** » 05 Mar 2008 08:48

*Bump*

Shamelessly *Bump*

Tleszer · Post by **Tleszer** » 05 Mar 2008 17:50

Nice sig loremaster.

The Sons of Idaho · Post by **The Sons of Idaho** » 18 Mar 2008 18:29

In the House series an Ixian ghost teaches someone how to build a "foldspace radio".
Shaddam uses this invention at one point to chat with Leto.

The invention is forgotten about by Paul's time because the radio gives you headaches.

Maybe doesn't directly contradict anything... but is still just plain wierd and completely unecessary.

SandChigger · Post by **SandChigger** » 18 Mar 2008 19:19

Do you mean the silly "rogo transmitters" used by D'murr and C'span? (Or whatever their names were.)

orald · Post by **orald** » 19 Mar 2008 03:49

Yea, I remember, something with some exotic crystals or some shit KJA undoubtably stole from his works in the ST universe(were EVERYTHING is an exotic particle/alloy/metal/compund/molecule/mineral etc).

The Sons of Idaho · Post by **The Sons of Idaho** » 19 Mar 2008 09:32

SandChigger wrote:Do you mean the silly "rogo transmitters"

Yep.

Named after an Ixian named Rogo, who taught C'Tair how to build it after he was dead. He was taught by visions of a dead guy (and I'm pretty sure there was no OM involved, latent or otherwise).

The guild adopts this technology briefly, and the Emperor gets to try it out in a ridiculous scene which made him sound like some guy in the 1900s using a telephone for the first time. ("Wow, it sounds like you're in the next room!")

Apparently, it makes your brain bleed or whatever, so the guild abandons the idea. (Instead of trying to fix this glitch in a technology that would change the face of intersteller communication/commerce and give them even more of a monopoly).

orald wrote:Yea, I remember, something with some exotic crystals or some shit KJA undoubtably stole from his works in the ST universe(were EVERYTHING is an exotic particle/alloy/metal/compund/molecule/mineral etc).

I think he had to dismantle his light sabre to make it.

orald · Post by **orald** » 19 Mar 2008 10:39

The Sons of Idaho wrote:I think he had to dismantle his light sabre to make it.

More like his light-dildo.

Post by **Omphalos** » 19 Mar 2008 11:12

I think it was quite inconsistent of them to call the books "Dune." Does that count for this thread?

SandChigger · Post by **SandChigger** » 19 Mar 2008 12:07

orald wrote:
The Sons of Idaho wrote:I think he had to dismantle his light sabre to make it.
More like his light-dildo.

Touché!

billnye · Post by **billnye** » 03 Apr 2008 23:21

"Auggh I've found an inconsistency‽"

"Either we did it on purpose or its just a book and you shouldn't worry"

Fantômas · Post by **Fantômas** » 04 Apr 2008 00:16

billnye wrote:"Auggh I've found an inconsistency‽"

"Either we did it on purpose or its just a book and you shouldn't worry"

Are you the Science Guy?

SandChigger · Post by **SandChigger** » 04 Apr 2008 00:55

"Of course it's just a book and not a matter of life or death. But why would you intentionally include something that contradicts what was written before?"

"You're just a hater."