Dune Novels

GamePlayer · Post by **GamePlayer** » 26 May 2008 18:50

SandChigger wrote:
That transmission had traveled for thousands of years, degrading along the way, deteriorating into something else. Erasmus had no memory of that endless, silent journey at the speed of light. After their incalculable trek through static and interstellar waste, the Omnius signal had encountered one of the long-dispatched probes and seized upon it as a beachhead. Far, far from any taint of human civilization, the restored Omnius began to re-create itself. Over millennia it had regenerated, building a new Synchronized Empire-and Omnius had begun making plans to return, this time with a far superior machine force.
"[T]housands of years ... at the speed of light" does NOT an "incalculable trek" make; you wind up only (only!) a few thousand light years from where you started. Which means the probe picked up the signal somewhere well within what would later become the Imperium.

They still haven't learned that just because they say it, put it down on paper, it makes it so or it makes sense.

Fucking unbelievable.

I HATE reading shit like that in a science fiction story. I really wish writers would at least learn the medium in which they are writing. The Milky Way Galaxy is 120,000 light years in diameter. A few thousand years at light speed isn't enough to get out of the Milky Way even if one were going perpendicular to the plane. Not to mention that stupid wording; an "incalculable journey"? They just said a few thousand years at light speed.

I share your frustration. Total fucking crap.

A Thing of Eternity · Post by **A Thing of Eternity** » 26 May 2008 19:20

Hey! Someone (I know there's some people here who like the prequils) better have a rebuttal for my post or I'm going to be sorely dissapointed.

orald · Post by **orald** » 26 May 2008 19:28

Kevin is a sci-fi god made flesh.

There's your rebuttal, happy?

SandChigger · Post by **SandChigger** » 26 May 2008 22:05

orald wrote:Wait, wwasn't the signal born on a laser beam? Isn't that kinda focused?

Yep. But over the distance involved even a laser beam would become more diffuse.

I didn't see it written it was sent in all kinds of directions, so WTF are the chances for an Omnibus Prime probe to be at the correct angle to pick it up after thousands of years?

Astronomically small. It's the sort of thing that, when it happens in real life, people say, "Wow...truth IS stranger than fiction!"

And if it's degraded, then where do we see any failures, hmm? IDK much about programs, but if I messed up lots of lines(or even a few) of the code, wouldn't it usually not function?

Depends on how important the part of the program is that you mess up.

The real problem is that there's no way to compress such a presumably vast amount of data (remember, there's a forgotten archived version of Erasmus in there as well—that's how he gets resurrected) into a "datapacket" that could be transmitted in such a short burst of laser light. Whatever the superadvanced future data compression technique used, the data still has to be encoded in a discrete, detectable patterning of the photons in the laser. DATA ITSELF ISN'T TRANSMITTED IN A SIGNAL, only a pattern that is used to recreate the data upon reception. To carry a vast amount of data, you need to transmit a LONG signal.

What we have here is science fantasy, not science fiction.

And it assumes the reader is a science illiterate. And for the most part, that seems a fairly accurate assessment of the fans of these books.

And the worst part of it is, the idiots aren't bothered by their ignorance.

Pardot Kynes · Post by **Pardot Kynes** » 27 May 2008 00:58

Chigger, that's because the primary audience for these books are younger people who have never been exposed to better books. We need to introduce them slowly.
To this end, I propose the following.

Have em read 1984, and then Foundation. Then Morte De Arthur. Then Crime and Punishment, and A Song of Ice and Fire. Then have them pick out one book from every isle in the nonfiction and fiction sections of the library, and have them read 5 of each type. If they don't have an appreciation of literature in all its forms by then, we should shoot them.

SandChigger · Post by **SandChigger** » 27 May 2008 01:52

Oh, Pardot, what an idealist you are!

Great books, but they'll never sit still long enough to read all those.

Besides...don't you realize that complacent stupidity is the new chic?

Let's just go ahead and shoot them. But bring lots of ammo...there's a WHOLE bunch of them now.

orald · Post by **orald** » 27 May 2008 07:48

Pardot Kynes wrote:We need to introduce them slowly.

We need to kill them slowly.

Have em read 1984, and then Foundation. Then Morte De Arthur. Then Crime and Punishment, and A Song of Ice and Fire. Then have them pick out one book from every isle in the nonfiction and fiction sections of the library, and have them read 5 of each type. If they don't have an appreciation of literature in all its forms by then, we should shoot them.

Then shoot me right now.
1984- Read.

Foundation- Read(shitty last books and pre's though).

Morte De Arthur- Huh? Oh, I see, but why give the Frenchie name?

Then Crime and Punishment- Never read, but I presume "snore" is the answer.

A Song of Ice and Fire- Yes!

Then have them pick out one book from every isle in the nonfiction and fiction sections of the library- "Non fiction"? You mean encyclopedias, history books and dictionaries?
Other than those it's all fiction, mate.

inhuien · Post by **inhuien** » 27 May 2008 08:21

"Other than those it's all fiction, mate."

Lost the will to live replying to your latest nihilistic generalisation. So consider yourself Blah'd at.

orald · Post by **orald** » 27 May 2008 08:38

What's not fiction then? It always has some sort of distortion to events if it's not an encyclopedia etc(and lets not get into discussing relative truths).

Isn't a a thriller or detective story "fiction"? They're just not science fiction?

Care to disprove me by giving some example, or do you just like to generalize me again and again?

Pardot Kynes · Post by **Pardot Kynes** » 27 May 2008 09:25

Orald, I was referring to how books are sorted out in the library. If I could reach through the internet and slap you on the back of the head, I do believe I would

Crime and Punishment is probably one of the most emotionally tearing stories ever written. If I wanted to torture someone, though, I would force them to read the Ghormenghast series all the way through.

Good books, but christ.... You won't be able to sleep afterwards.

And, chig, we could buy them the audiotape

Nekhrun · Post by **Nekhrun** » 27 May 2008 10:00

7 Days without Dune Novels makes 1 (arnoldo) weak.

Tyrant · Post by **Tyrant** » 27 May 2008 10:57

orald wrote:What's not fiction then? It always has some sort of distortion to events if it's not an encyclopedia etc(and lets not get into discussing relative truths).

Isn't a a thriller or detective story "fiction"? They're just not science fiction?

Care to disprove me by giving some example, or do you just like to generalize me again and again?

Conan the Librarian: Dont u know the dewey DECIMAL SYSTEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZHoHaAYHq8

orald · Post by **orald** » 27 May 2008 11:02

Pardot Kynes wrote:Crime and Punishment is probably one of the most emotionally tearing stories ever written.

Yea, I bet. Sissy boy.

SandChigger · Post by **SandChigger** » 27 May 2008 12:06

(snicker)

You're closer, Pard. You go slap him this time.

Pardot Kynes · Post by **Pardot Kynes** » 27 May 2008 13:32

Oh ya.

orald · Post by **orald** » 27 May 2008 13:38

Geez, that's one ugly kid.

Pardot Kynes · Post by **Pardot Kynes** » 27 May 2008 13:41

So?

A Thing of Eternity · Post by **A Thing of Eternity** » 27 May 2008 13:45

I'm still waiting for some kind of response from a certain someone who called bullshit on one of my posts and was the reason I posted that gigantic rant of mine. I'd hold my breath but I'm worried about passing out.

Pardot Kynes · Post by **Pardot Kynes** » 27 May 2008 13:47

I don't think there are really any people here who will attempt to defend against an obviously solid argument, prequel fan or not.

orald · Post by **orald** » 27 May 2008 13:50

Pardot Kynes wrote:I don't think there are really any people here who will attempt to defend against an obviously solid argument, prequel fan or not.

Is that a challange I hear, ser knight?

Pardot Kynes · Post by **Pardot Kynes** » 27 May 2008 13:55

I'd laugh my ass off if you accepted- the challenge is to DEFEND the prequels, and defend them well!

Do you accept Sir Orald of the Tree?

orald · Post by **orald** » 27 May 2008 14:06

Of the Tree?

Ser, you have the honor to speak to the Knight o' Pansies!

But I must decline, as well as I understood the challange from the start, I must refuse for fear of my sanity.

Pardot Kynes · Post by **Pardot Kynes** » 27 May 2008 14:22

Aye, indeed thou art the Knight of the Pansies! Nay, we must consider thee more than a knight, for thine attributes are greater than thy title! We must consider thee the King, or perhaps, because thine attributes are SO encompassing, the EMPEROR of Pansies!

All hail the Pansy Emperor!

orald · Post by **orald** » 27 May 2008 14:33

I'll send Loras to cut up your manhood and feed it to the Stone Crows' goats.

Pardot Kynes · Post by **Pardot Kynes** » 27 May 2008 14:37

Aye, indeed thou proveth thine title! Thou canst do thine OWN castrating!

Aha, we so avow that we will send Sir Loras' head on a plate of silver, with its purpose carved upon it! It shalt say "A Gift to the Emperor of Pansies, our most respected Patriarch of the Church of Flowers". Aye, it shalt be a splendid gift, fit for a King! For, we can also avow, a gift fit for thine august self would impose itself too much upon our treasury!