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Posted: 30 May 2008 16:07
by Hunchback Jack
This series stretches my tolerance of BH and KJA beyond endurance.
Not only are these books totally unnecessary - FH jumps forward in time between books for a *reason* - they are clearly just milking the Dune brand for all its worth.
I found a Jan 2000 online interview with KJA and BH which is illuminating. I've included the whole question and answer, to preserve context. Emphasis is mine.
LR: What about Dune 7?
KJA: Well, we have a full outline for Dune 7. We know where Frank Herbert was going but we've been talking to a lot of the fans and we've been talking to each other and we think that the next big story that needs to be told is the Butlerian Jihad -- the war against the thinking machines 10,000 years ago. It tells the original split between the families of Atreides and Harkonnen.
BH: Isn't that timely, also? Machines against humans? Artificial intelligence we're concerned about now.
KJA: So we have the outline for Dune 7 and we know where Frank Herbert is going and where he intended to end the story, but we find that there's a lot of things we need to set up before that. And also it seems kind of fitting that Dune 7 should be the grand finale. And you don't do the grand finale and then add a few more books. But, we have the notes. People should be able to have Dune books from now on.
BH: Every year for a while, but we're going to maintain the quality or else we won't write one.
You don't do the grand finale and then add a few more books.
So don't, BH and KJA. Just don't.
HBJ
Posted: 30 May 2008 16:29
by A Thing of Eternity
When they said they were going to do more books in the Duniverse I assumed they'd played out the existing plotlines and were going to do some books about the 10,000 years after the Jihad, maybe with the BG or Mentats as a focus. That they would go and monkey around (further) with the plots of the original books is arrogance beyond arrogance.
Posted: 30 May 2008 16:56
by Omphalos
Hunchback Jack wrote:This series stretches my tolerance of BH and KJA beyond endurance.
Not only are these books totally unnecessary - FH jumps forward in time between books for a *reason* - they are clearly just milking the Dune brand for all its worth.
I found a Jan 2000 online interview with KJA and BH which is illuminating. I've included the whole question and answer, to preserve context. Emphasis is mine.
LR: What about Dune 7?
KJA: Well, we have a full outline for Dune 7. We know where Frank Herbert was going but we've been talking to a lot of the fans and we've been talking to each other and we think that the next big story that needs to be told is the Butlerian Jihad -- the war against the thinking machines 10,000 years ago. It tells the original split between the families of Atreides and Harkonnen.
BH: Isn't that timely, also? Machines against humans? Artificial intelligence we're concerned about now.
KJA: So we have the outline for Dune 7 and we know where Frank Herbert is going and where he intended to end the story, but we find that there's a lot of things we need to set up before that. And also it seems kind of fitting that Dune 7 should be the grand finale. And you don't do the grand finale and then add a few more books. But, we have the notes. People should be able to have Dune books from now on.
BH: Every year for a while, but we're going to maintain the quality or else we won't write one.
You don't do the grand finale and then add a few more books.
So don't, BH and KJA. Just don't.
HBJ
Somebody who has access go post this on his blog and see what his response is.
Posted: 30 May 2008 16:59
by Nekhrun
KJA: Well, we have a full outline for Dune 7.
Didn't they say in another spot that they didn't have a full outline that it was really just some bits and pieces?
BH: Isn't that timely, also? Machines against humans? Artificial intelligence we're concerned about now.
Yeah, it really concerns the shit out of me.
BH: Every year for a while, but we're going to maintain the quality or else we won't write one.
Thank God. I wouldn't want the quality to slip at all.
Nice find HBJ.
Posted: 30 May 2008 18:13
by Hunchback Jack
Thanks, Nekhrun. I found that interview about a week ago, and have been looking for somewhere to vent about it since. I guess this is the right place
.
BTW, the entire interview can be found
here.
HBJ
Posted: 30 May 2008 18:17
by orald
People should be able to have Dune books from now on.
Funny. So hat do I call those FH doorstoppers I've had all this time, eh?
Posted: 30 May 2008 18:24
by A Thing of Eternity
From the same interview:
Dad used to say, "Get your science right when you're building a world." Well, we had to get our facts right to write in the Dune universe. But dad would say he didn't want to receive a letter that began, "Dear Jerk."
Wow. Someone should forward that to KJA too.
You know what these guys would be doing if they weren't writing pop novels? Selling used fucking cars.
Posted: 30 May 2008 19:27
by SandChigger
Don't you just love the "My ass in yer faces, Dune fans!" look on Kevin's face in the photo?
But what's that shit about "Sons of Dune"? Fuck...they
have adopted Kevin into the family!
This is going to be a goldmine! Great find!
This is from 2000, right? Bruce Herbert was already dead by then, so there weren't "three" of them, present tense.
This was choice, too:
KJA: Oh, yeah. We can't just write one book a year. I did nine last year and 14 the year before that.
Beware: He will bury us with verbal shite from his diarrheic bum!
Posted: 30 May 2008 19:36
by Nekhrun
Damn it! Everything they do is so damn ridiculous. That photo looks like something someone would put together to make fun of them. I like how they plaster the fucking word DUNE over everything they do. I also like how KJA is standing in front with little Brian in the background peeking his head in.
Every day seems to bring a new discovery and another contradiction from the Hacks Twain.
Posted: 30 May 2008 19:41
by A Thing of Eternity
When you condsider that it took FH about 25 years to write 6 Dune novels and these two pump out one a year I have no idea how they honestly thought that they could even come close to the same quality. Yes, I realize FH wrote other books inbetween, but he was likely compiling notes and outlines for the next Dune novels during those periods. From my foray's into art and writing it's actually easier to go back and forth between multiple projects; if you feel blocked on one, work on the other. It also prevents you from rushing, and forces you to come back to things again and again. That's just my take though.
Posted: 30 May 2008 19:50
by SandChigger
Kevin has often blahgs the same thing. Of course, with him, he's got ten or twenty projects all going at the same time.
Posted: 30 May 2008 19:54
by A Thing of Eternity
Yeah... I'm thinking more like... 2 would be productive. Any ass that thinks they can write 14 books a year and isn't Asimov gets a big thumbs down from me.
Posted: 30 May 2008 22:36
by Hunchback Jack
Well, (somewhat off-topic), even Asimov kept it down to six or seven a year, I think. And some of those were science essay collections, etc.
Not that I'm in any way comparing Asimov to KJA in terms of quality. Asimov was a fine SF writer, and an unparalleled science writer. He appeared to have real affection for his readers, and a burning desire to inform as well as entertain. Even fifteen years after his death, he is sorely missed.
(Sorry about that, but I have immense respect for the Good Doctor).
HBJ
Posted: 30 May 2008 22:40
by A Thing of Eternity
As do I.
Posted: 30 May 2008 22:44
by SandChigger
AS DO WE ALL!
Posted: 30 May 2008 23:27
by Dune Nerd
Asimov is a genius and in no way can a genius be compared with P&B
Posted: 31 May 2008 02:41
by SandChigger
Idiot superstars for a dumber age.
Posted: 31 May 2008 02:57
by A Thing of Eternity
Chig it's hilarious how often your name comes up when googling info on the new novels. Especially if you add something like "inconsistencies" or "negative review" etc.
Posted: 31 May 2008 03:50
by SandChigger
What can I say: hit hoor.
Posted: 31 May 2008 05:08
by Serkanner
Omphalos wrote:Hunchback Jack wrote:This series stretches my tolerance of BH and KJA beyond endurance.
Not only are these books totally unnecessary - FH jumps forward in time between books for a *reason* - they are clearly just milking the Dune brand for all its worth.
I found a Jan 2000 online interview with KJA and BH which is illuminating. I've included the whole question and answer, to preserve context. Emphasis is mine.
LR: What about Dune 7?
KJA: Well, we have a full outline for Dune 7. We know where Frank Herbert was going but we've been talking to a lot of the fans and we've been talking to each other and we think that the next big story that needs to be told is the Butlerian Jihad -- the war against the thinking machines 10,000 years ago. It tells the original split between the families of Atreides and Harkonnen.
BH: Isn't that timely, also? Machines against humans? Artificial intelligence we're concerned about now.
KJA: So we have the outline for Dune 7 and we know where Frank Herbert is going and where he intended to end the story, but we find that there's a lot of things we need to set up before that. And also it seems kind of fitting that Dune 7 should be the grand finale. And you don't do the grand finale and then add a few more books. But, we have the notes. People should be able to have Dune books from now on.
BH: Every year for a while, but we're going to maintain the quality or else we won't write one.
You don't do the grand finale and then add a few more books.
So don't, BH and KJA. Just don't.
HBJ
Somebody who has access go post this on his blog and see what his response is.
Posted
LINK
Posted: 31 May 2008 09:16
by SandChigger
Enjoy your ability to post on his blog while it lasts.
(It won't last much longer!
)
He's such a sackless coward.
Posted: 31 May 2008 11:01
by Serkanner
SandChigger wrote:Enjoy your ability to post on his blog while it lasts.
(It won't last much longer!
)
He's such a sackless coward.
Aint that the truth!
As of yet he hasn't replied to my question regarding visit to Europe for some decent book-burning events, so I am afraid he will not reply to this one either.
Of course we can always hope.
Posted: 31 May 2008 11:57
by Omphalos
Excellent!
Posted: 31 May 2008 14:37
by A Thing of Eternity
I have to say, someone advised KJA and BH well as far as the order of the books in this series. Classic essay style arranging of strengths. Put your second strongest/most interesting work first (Paul) - followed by your mediocre works, from stronger to weaker if more than one, in this case Jessica then Irulan - and finish with your strongest/most interesting (leto). Hooks people, then the frog gets brought to a boil of shittyness slowly so as not to be noticed, then finish with the "best". People generally remember the first and last of a given set of information, forgetting what was in the middle.
Doesn't do much if the whole series is a pile of shite though
Posted: 31 May 2008 19:19
by SandChigger
You're making assumptions there about
Leto of Dune that I certainly wouldn't be willing to.
Hey, the slippery shit has replied:
We haven't changed our minds. Dune 7 (HUNTERS and SANDWORMS) is the grand finale and we don't plan to write any stories beyond that, as we said in our interview eight years ago. These new novels are set in a much earlier time frame.
(Don't tell me you didn't kinda see this gambit coming.)