Jᴀᴄᴜʀᴜᴛᴜ - Tʜᴇ Cᴀsᴛ Oᴜᴛ

Freakzilla wrote:

Dune Nerd wrote:

A Thing of Eternity wrote:

Dune Nerd wrote:In acoustic wave theory the best approximation is a sine wave. This allows models to be made but the underlying primary assumption the wave theory that I have seen uses the sine wave as the most appropriate approximation of what the actual wave looks like. When a sound is heard as 'perfect' or just right it is closer to a sine wave where as the static from your tv without an input is not very close to a sine wave at all.

At least this is my understanding, more from a light wave propagation but it is the same principle.

You're right, the static on your tv is mostly squared waves (I still think of them as sinewaves though, just damaged ones).

Yea that is how I think of it. I deal more with waves in a mechanical and optical sense but I get the gist of your point. All makes sense to me

Aren't the TV images square now too, since it's digital?

No, that's no longer waves at all, just binary. Transmitted on a wave though I guess.

A Thing of Eternity wrote:

Freakzilla wrote:

Dune Nerd wrote:

A Thing of Eternity wrote:

Dune Nerd wrote:In acoustic wave theory the best approximation is a sine wave. This allows models to be made but the underlying primary assumption the wave theory that I have seen uses the sine wave as the most appropriate approximation of what the actual wave looks like. When a sound is heard as 'perfect' or just right it is closer to a sine wave where as the static from your tv without an input is not very close to a sine wave at all.

At least this is my understanding, more from a light wave propagation but it is the same principle.

You're right, the static on your tv is mostly squared waves (I still think of them as sinewaves though, just damaged ones).

Yea that is how I think of it. I deal more with waves in a mechanical and optical sense but I get the gist of your point. All makes sense to me

Aren't the TV images square now too, since it's digital?

No, that's no longer waves at all, just binary. Transmitted on a wave though I guess.

Digital waveform:


Analgo waveform:

Freakzilla wrote:

A Thing of Eternity wrote:

Freakzilla wrote:

Dune Nerd wrote:

A Thing of Eternity wrote:

Dune Nerd wrote:In acoustic wave theory the best approximation is a sine wave. This allows models to be made but the underlying primary assumption the wave theory that I have seen uses the sine wave as the most appropriate approximation of what the actual wave looks like. When a sound is heard as 'perfect' or just right it is closer to a sine wave where as the static from your tv without an input is not very close to a sine wave at all.

At least this is my understanding, more from a light wave propagation but it is the same principle.

You're right, the static on your tv is mostly squared waves (I still think of them as sinewaves though, just damaged ones).

Yea that is how I think of it. I deal more with waves in a mechanical and optical sense but I get the gist of your point. All makes sense to me

Aren't the TV images square now too, since it's digital?

No, that's no longer waves at all, just binary. Transmitted on a wave though I guess.

Digital waveform:


Analgo waveform:

Yes yes! Fucker. That's what I mean when I say binary, on-off-on-off, full square wave. You are correct, it is technically still a wave...

The second diagram shows how they actually transmit the digital though, on an analogue wave.

It blows my mind to see how this topic went from writing a book to binary.

Laphtiya wrote:It blows my mind to see how this topic went from writing a book to binary.

That tends to happen a lot around here.

It seems to me that you're talking about apples and oranges here. Square waves aren't necessarily binary, although I suppose they could be. It would be a boring wave though.

And digital signals aren't necessarily square in appearance. The sampling looks more like this:



Each dot represents a single digital sample, and can be any value. The binary only comes in to represent those varying values in the wave.

And even a square-shaped waveform isn't necessarily on or off. See the "time" line in freak's second diagram there? That line usually represents zero (assuming its a perfect sine wave). When it dips below, there are negative values. You're talking about totally different things here.

And Thing, the damage you're talking anbout in TV noise would be called "clipping."

Drunken Idaho wrote:It seems to me that you're talking about apples and oranges here. Square waves aren't necessarily binary, although I suppose they could be. It would be a boring wave though.

And digital signals aren't necessarily square in appearance. The sampling looks more like this:


Each dot represents a single digital sample, and can be any value. The binary only comes in to represent those varying values in the wave.

And even a square-shaped waveform isn't necessarily on or off. See the "time" line in freak's second diagram there? That line usually represents zero (assuming its a perfect sine wave). When it dips below, there are negative values. You're talking about totally different things here.

And Thing, the damage you're talking anbout in TV noise would be called "clipping."

I know! (to all the points, especially the on about clipping) You're right about the square wave not being on off though, I appologize, I wasn't thinking clearly!