Interview with EVeryone's Favourite Dictater
Moderators: Omphalos, Freakzilla, ᴶᵛᵀᴬ
- Phaedrus
- Posts: 551
- Joined: 09 Feb 2008 04:35
Oh. If A, then B. B, therefore A?
That's easy, it's affirming the consequent.
Edit: Actually, that's a more simplistic version of what's going on here. The actual, full argument would be more like:
A: Frank's books are good.
B: Frank's books were initially disliked.
C: Eventually, Frank's books were acknowledged as good.
KJA is making a bad generalization: Books that are good are always acknowledged as being good. SO:
A: KJA's books are disliked.
B: Books that are good will eventually be acknowledged as being good.
THEREFORE
C: KJA's books will eventually be acknowledged as being good.
D: KJA's books are good.
However, this is faulty logic, because he has to assume that his books are good in order to prove that they are good. Since they are not good, even though (B) is false, his books will not necessarily be acknowledged as good.
That's easy, it's affirming the consequent.
Edit: Actually, that's a more simplistic version of what's going on here. The actual, full argument would be more like:
A: Frank's books are good.
B: Frank's books were initially disliked.
C: Eventually, Frank's books were acknowledged as good.
KJA is making a bad generalization: Books that are good are always acknowledged as being good. SO:
A: KJA's books are disliked.
B: Books that are good will eventually be acknowledged as being good.
THEREFORE
C: KJA's books will eventually be acknowledged as being good.
D: KJA's books are good.
However, this is faulty logic, because he has to assume that his books are good in order to prove that they are good. Since they are not good, even though (B) is false, his books will not necessarily be acknowledged as good.
- GamePlayer
- 70mm God
- Posts: 2993
- Joined: 09 Feb 2008 11:26
- Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Thanks for the quotes. That confirms all I need to know about this crap.
Having just finished reading Dune Messiah for only my second time, I have to say I like it much more now as an adult than I did as a child. Most importantly, I appreciate the high quality of the writing. It's still not as good as Dune, but it is head and shoulders above most science fiction literature.
On the subject of KJA and his remarks, Herbert's work was worth re-examination after first release had come and gone. KJA's books are literature's equivalent of the vapid summer blockbuster made to sell the month of release and forgotten next month. Such books will never be re-examined except when historians include them as highly visible examples of the mediocre consumerism that plagued the 1990's and 2000's when nearly all art forms were at their lowest point in their respective centuries.
Having just finished reading Dune Messiah for only my second time, I have to say I like it much more now as an adult than I did as a child. Most importantly, I appreciate the high quality of the writing. It's still not as good as Dune, but it is head and shoulders above most science fiction literature.
On the subject of KJA and his remarks, Herbert's work was worth re-examination after first release had come and gone. KJA's books are literature's equivalent of the vapid summer blockbuster made to sell the month of release and forgotten next month. Such books will never be re-examined except when historians include them as highly visible examples of the mediocre consumerism that plagued the 1990's and 2000's when nearly all art forms were at their lowest point in their respective centuries.
- SandChigger
- KJASF Ground Zero
- Posts: 14492
- Joined: 08 Feb 2008 22:29
- Location: A continuing state of irritation
- Contact:
I think the bad generalization that Kevin (and Byron, as yesman) usually makes is:
All books popularly acknowledged as good (by sales figures, in-the-pocket reviewers, etc.) are good.
Now back to the fun stuff:
ForAll(x)( ( book(x) And wrote(FH,x) ) Then good(x) ) = All FH books are good.
...
(I'm sure there's a way of doing this! )
All books popularly acknowledged as good (by sales figures, in-the-pocket reviewers, etc.) are good.
Now back to the fun stuff:
ForAll(x)( ( book(x) And wrote(FH,x) ) Then good(x) ) = All FH books are good.
...
(I'm sure there's a way of doing this! )
"Let the dead give water to the dead. As for me, it's NO MORE FUCKING TEARS!"
- Omphalos
- Inglorious Bastard
- Posts: 6677
- Joined: 05 Feb 2008 11:07
- Location: The Mighty Central Valley of California
- Contact:
AAAARRRRGGGGAAAA! Modus ponuns, modus tollens!!!! Run!!!!!SandChigger wrote:Hmmmmmmm....Omphalos wrote:False syllogism?
I've been trying to figure it out using this page: http://www.duniho.com/fergus/sillysyllogisms.html
ARGH! It's been too long since I did this formal logic!
The only class I have ever failed.
- GodEmperorJason
- Posts: 12
- Joined: 12 Feb 2008 02:07
Its both funny and sad how pathetic this interview was. He places the burden on the fans like we are some fickle fools that don't like anything but the original Dune. He claims constraint by FHs notes, but he obviously took a lot of liberties.
"MY WORDS ARE YOUR PAST, MY QUESTIONS ARE SIMPLE:
"WITH WHOM DO YOU ALLY?
"WITH THE SELF-IDOLATORS OF TLEILAX?
"WITH MY FISH SPEAKER BUREAUCRACY?
"WITH THE COSMOS-WANDERING GUILD?
"WITH HARKONNEN BLOOD SACRIFICERS?
"WITH A DOGMATIC SINK OF YOUR OWN CREATION?
"HOW WILL YOU MEET YOUR END?
"AS NO MORE THAN A SECRET SOCIETY?"
"WITH WHOM DO YOU ALLY?
"WITH THE SELF-IDOLATORS OF TLEILAX?
"WITH MY FISH SPEAKER BUREAUCRACY?
"WITH THE COSMOS-WANDERING GUILD?
"WITH HARKONNEN BLOOD SACRIFICERS?
"WITH A DOGMATIC SINK OF YOUR OWN CREATION?
"HOW WILL YOU MEET YOUR END?
"AS NO MORE THAN A SECRET SOCIETY?"
- tanzeelat
- Posts: 16
- Joined: 12 Feb 2008 07:23
Er, what awards? What "best-of-the-year" lists? Not one of the BH/KJA Dune books has appeared on the shortlists for any of the major genre awards. I have a Tor promo booklet for The Machine Crusade at home, and it mentions "critical acclaim". I scoffed when I first read that. I'm still scoffing...Brian and I have now written ten novels in the Dune universe, and they have been extremely well received, winning numerous awards and being selected as New York Times Notable book (absolutely unheard-of for a novel written in somebody else’s universe), many best-of-the-year lists, etc.
- Omphalos
- Inglorious Bastard
- Posts: 6677
- Joined: 05 Feb 2008 11:07
- Location: The Mighty Central Valley of California
- Contact:
Those are fucking lies. But I wonder if he is talking about some bullshit award that book publishers award to their stables of authors. I would not put that kind of misdirection past him (Dune scholar, anyone?)tanzeelat wrote:Er, what awards? What "best-of-the-year" lists? Not one of the BH/KJA Dune books has appeared on the shortlists for any of the major genre awards. I have a Tor promo booklet for The Machine Crusade at home, and it mentions "critical acclaim". I scoffed when I first read that. I'm still scoffing...Brian and I have now written ten novels in the Dune universe, and they have been extremely well received, winning numerous awards and being selected as New York Times Notable book (absolutely unheard-of for a novel written in somebody else’s universe), many best-of-the-year lists, etc.
- Tleilax Master B
- Posts: 674
- Joined: 11 Feb 2008 10:54
- Location: Desert of New Mexico
Hey, wait a minute!!! I'm an award winning poster on the Jacurutu forum! Seriously, I just awarded myself the first annual "Master B's Award for Posting Excellence in the Category of DUNE."Omphalos wrote:Those are fucking lies. But I wonder if he is talking about some bullshit award that book publishers award to their stables of authors. I would not put that kind of misdirection past him (Dune scholar, anyone?)tanzeelat wrote:Er, what awards? What "best-of-the-year" lists? Not one of the BH/KJA Dune books has appeared on the shortlists for any of the major genre awards. I have a Tor promo booklet for The Machine Crusade at home, and it mentions "critical acclaim". I scoffed when I first read that. I'm still scoffing...Brian and I have now written ten novels in the Dune universe, and they have been extremely well received, winning numerous awards and being selected as New York Times Notable book (absolutely unheard-of for a novel written in somebody else’s universe), many best-of-the-year lists, etc.
- Omphalos
- Inglorious Bastard
- Posts: 6677
- Joined: 05 Feb 2008 11:07
- Location: The Mighty Central Valley of California
- Contact:
I think that is just like the one that Stephen Colbert put on his book "I Am America, And So Can You."Tleilax Master B wrote:Hey, wait a minute!!! I'm an award winning poster on the Jacurutu forum! Seriously, I just awarded myself the first annual "Master B's Award for Posting Excellence in the Category of DUNE."Omphalos wrote:Those are fucking lies. But I wonder if he is talking about some bullshit award that book publishers award to their stables of authors. I would not put that kind of misdirection past him (Dune scholar, anyone?)tanzeelat wrote:Er, what awards? What "best-of-the-year" lists? Not one of the BH/KJA Dune books has appeared on the shortlists for any of the major genre awards. I have a Tor promo booklet for The Machine Crusade at home, and it mentions "critical acclaim". I scoffed when I first read that. I'm still scoffing...Brian and I have now written ten novels in the Dune universe, and they have been extremely well received, winning numerous awards and being selected as New York Times Notable book (absolutely unheard-of for a novel written in somebody else’s universe), many best-of-the-year lists, etc.
- Mr. Teg
- Moderator
- Posts: 708
- Joined: 11 Feb 2008 10:14
- Location: Chair
- Contact:
- Tyrant
- Posts: 381
- Joined: 08 Feb 2008 22:45
- Location: Kansas City, MO
Mr. Teg wrote:If I were a Herbert I would be pissed off by Kevin's answers.
But...
I get they impression they don't care either way.
Kevin's bitches!
anyone know if Byron is registered here?..probably not...with all the banned people here..but just curious...although he is a 'yes' man..i still have always liked him
Your friendly neighborhood Tyrant!!!
- Freakzilla
- Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
- Posts: 18454
- Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
- Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
- Contact:
He is.Tyrant wrote:Mr. Teg wrote:If I were a Herbert I would be pissed off by Kevin's answers.
But...
I get they impression they don't care either way.
Kevin's bitches!
anyone know if Byron is registered here?..probably not...with all the banned people here..but just curious...although he is a 'yes' man..i still have always liked him
- Omphalos
- Inglorious Bastard
- Posts: 6677
- Joined: 05 Feb 2008 11:07
- Location: The Mighty Central Valley of California
- Contact:
Yep.Tyrant wrote:Mr. Teg wrote:If I were a Herbert I would be pissed off by Kevin's answers.
But...
I get they impression they don't care either way.
Kevin's bitches!
anyone know if Byron is registered here?..probably not...with all the banned people here..but just curious...although he is a 'yes' man..i still have always liked him
- Mr. Teg
- Moderator
- Posts: 708
- Joined: 11 Feb 2008 10:14
- Location: Chair
- Contact:
Brian, Byron or both?Tyrant wrote:Mr. Teg wrote:If I were a Herbert I would be pissed off by Kevin's answers.
But...
I get they impression they don't care either way.
Kevin's bitches!
anyone know if Byron is registered here?..probably not...with all the banned people here..but just curious...although he is a 'yes' man..i still have always liked him
CHOAM
Combine Herbert Ober Anderson Mercantile, Narf!
Brian, Kevin & Byron The HLP
Combine Herbert Ober Anderson Mercantile, Narf!
Brian, Kevin & Byron The HLP
- Omphalos
- Inglorious Bastard
- Posts: 6677
- Joined: 05 Feb 2008 11:07
- Location: The Mighty Central Valley of California
- Contact:
- Talos Aquinas
- Posts: 71
- Joined: 09 Feb 2008 14:43
- Location: Lurking in Alia's Other Memory...
- Mr. Teg
- Moderator
- Posts: 708
- Joined: 11 Feb 2008 10:14
- Location: Chair
- Contact:
No kidding! Ol'Pussy Willow is registered, too.Freakzilla wrote:He is.Tyrant wrote:Mr. Teg wrote:If I were a Herbert I would be pissed off by Kevin's answers.
But...
I get they impression they don't care either way.
Kevin's bitches!
anyone know if Byron is registered here?..probably not...with all the banned people here..but just curious...although he is a 'yes' man..i still have always liked him
CHOAM
Combine Herbert Ober Anderson Mercantile, Narf!
Brian, Kevin & Byron The HLP
Combine Herbert Ober Anderson Mercantile, Narf!
Brian, Kevin & Byron The HLP
- Tleilax Master B
- Posts: 674
- Joined: 11 Feb 2008 10:54
- Location: Desert of New Mexico
yup, "spice grandson"Tyrant wrote:Mr. Teg wrote:If I were a Herbert I would be pissed off by Kevin's answers.
But...
I get they impression they don't care either way.
Kevin's bitches!
anyone know if Byron is registered here?..probably not...with all the banned people here..but just curious...although he is a 'yes' man..i still have always liked him
-
- Posts: 21
- Joined: 15 Feb 2008 13:22
- Location: Citadel, Sareer
Kevin's a douche. There, I said it.
Atrocity is recognized as such by victim and perpetrator alike, by all who learn about it at whatever remove. Atrocity has no excuses, no mitigating argument. Atrocity never balances or rectifies the past. Atrocity merely arms the future for more atrocity. It is self-perpetuating upon itself—a barbarous form of incest. Whoever commits atrocity also commits those future atrocities thus bred.
-The Apocrypha of Muad'Dib
-The Apocrypha of Muad'Dib
- Omphalos
- Inglorious Bastard
- Posts: 6677
- Joined: 05 Feb 2008 11:07
- Location: The Mighty Central Valley of California
- Contact:
- Mr. Teg
- Moderator
- Posts: 708
- Joined: 11 Feb 2008 10:14
- Location: Chair
- Contact:
- GamePlayer
- 70mm God
- Posts: 2993
- Joined: 09 Feb 2008 11:26
- Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
- Freakzilla
- Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
- Posts: 18454
- Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
- Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
- Contact: