Jᴀᴄᴜʀᴜᴛᴜ - Tʜᴇ Cᴀsᴛ Oᴜᴛ

distrans wrote:but unless im reading it wrong
the sisters had access to far more experiences and lifetimes than leto had

so many more lifetimes than they had access to going back and back it makes little of the males side he did have fall into irrelevancy...

No, you're wrong. RM's had access to their entire female line going back, Paul and Leto II (and Ghanima?) had access to all of their entire male and female ancestors. In addition to that, the oracle also sees the future, as well as 'the now', neither of which the BG can do (although there is some vague reference to some BG maybe having a bit of prescient power). Plus Paul and Leto II were mentats, so in addition to having more information they could also retain and process more information than any non-mentat BG.

not sure how to make the point plainer

but sisters had access to many many more times more experiences than just some KW had given access to the male side


if memories were what it takes the sisters would have owned any pauls or leto2

The Seed wrote: ↑20 Dec 2023 13:12 GP was very important because the people was in a Loop doing the same thing over and over again. First he had to take complete control over their their life's and not let them move from place to place. This caused the people hate him( but later worship him) and to do anything to move to new places. He knew Evermind was out there and it was too early for the people to run into them. The BG and the Oracle needed to wake up to their faults about the Anti-Machine Laws. For a FUTURE the naturals and AI/ bio-engineered synthetics MUST work together.

No, no, no.

distrans wrote: ↑13 Jan 2022 21:34 not sure how to make the point plainer

but sisters had access to many many more times more experiences than just some KW had given access to the male side


if memories were what it takes the sisters would have owned any pauls or leto2

I know this is an old post but I'm curious how did you arrive to this conclusion.

A KH has full access to both sides, male and female. Not only that, but a KH can go back much further than any BG, in terms of ancestral memories. In GeoD, that is explicitly said when describing Leto's capabilities.

And, of course, there is prescience, which is also a whole continuum of experiences.

to be honest i dont know what i was trying to get at with such obviously rediculous comments...

RM sharing could account for it but if that was it id have stated it.

i dont recall any mention in the books of paul or leto sharing...

dunno


my take was that the sisters did extensive sharing across their ranks
particularly of key experiences in other lives not in their own personal past

but again,
if thats what i was refering to i did zero in expressing it

Freakzilla wrote: ↑18 Dec 2014 07:43 The empire WAS in a state of rebellion when Leto ascended, that's why he needed the Sardaukar so badly, to put it down.

Paul's Jihad was a temporary fix at best, but like Leto said, his vision wasn't broad enough.

if im wrong correct me
but hadnt his father just killed tens of billions across the know worlds
rendering dozens of them uninhabited???

rebellions certainly existed but it couldnt have been on a lessor foot to amount to anything...

i dont recall leto needing sadaukar for anything,
his empire is inherited and we only see it fully fleshed when fish speakers are his tool
where is this reference?

distrans wrote: ↑09 Sep 2024 22:37 rebellions certainly existed but it couldnt have been on a lessor foot to amount to anything...

In both DM and CoD there is a strong undercurrent of rebellion, with many factions at work trying to topple the religious empire. From the different conspiracies, even down to the Dune tarot to muddy the prescient waters, we have practically everyone trying to undo what the Fremen under Paul set up.

There is civil war at the end of CoD, Fremen are fighting amongst themselves and it has spread off-planet. That's why Leto needed the Sardaukar.

"Tyek tells me the fighting has spread off-planet," Jessica said. "The
Central Temple on Biarek is under siege."
~CoD