Jᴀᴄᴜʀᴜᴛᴜ - Tʜᴇ Cᴀsᴛ Oᴜᴛ

A Thing of Eternity wrote:One of the things I like about Herbert's writing I actually didn't notice until I'd been reading it for a while, was the constant head-hopping within scenes - it's significant that I didn't notice it for a while because this is my least favourite style, I prefer one point of view because it forces the author to show you what the other characters motivations are, rather than tell it. That I didn't even notice my most disliked style for a long time means that it was done in such an amazing way as to work.

Freakzilla wrote:melange ...
spice of Arrakis (Dune) with
geriatric properties first noted by Yanshuph Ashkoko, royal chemist in reign of Shakkad the Wise

SandRider wrote:this is one of my favorite free-standing chapters .... I'd like to see pulphope do it.

the only depiction of the individual life of a Sardaukar

reverendmotherQ. wrote:

SandRider wrote:this is one of my favorite free-standing chapters .... I'd like to see pulphope do it.

the only depiction of the individual life of a Sardaukar

I just now thought about it after reading this and realized your right. It is a lifestyle we never have a glimpse into outside of the Wensica context despite the fact they are mentioned and confronted with the customary reaction of "Oh-my-god-time-to-die" flight-or-fight response from their advesaries. I suppose since the Corrino family is not at the heart of the story Frank determined that there wasn't a need for it up until this point, but it's a morsel of a world that effects so many others in the events leading up to it(well, until Paul''s armies and ascent to the throne removed the spotlight from their symbol as a token of political power to the Corrino family).

Freakzilla wrote:OMG, I really phoned in that chapter summary, huh? I'm going to do another re-read soon...

Children of Dune wrote:People who served well in the corps of Farad'n, grandson of the late Shaddam IV, earned rich
promotions. One day, when the Prince was seated on his rightful throne, there
would be even greater promotions. A Bashar's rank might not be the end of it.
There were Baronies and Earldoms to be had on the many worlds of this realm . . .
once the twin Atreides were removed.

Dune wrote:My father, the Padishah Emperor, took me by the hand one day and I sensed in the
ways my mother had taught me that he was disturbed. He led me down the Hall of
Portraits to the ego-likeness of the Duke Leto Atreides. I marked the strong
resemblance between them--my father and this man in the portrait--both with
thin, elegant faces and sharp features dominated by cold eyes. "Princessdaughter,"
my father said, "I would that you'd been older when it came time for
this man to choose a woman." My father was 71 at the time and looking no older
than the man in the portrait, and I was but 14, yet I remember deducing in that
instant that my father secretly wished the Duke had been his son, and disliked
the political necessities that made them enemies.
-"In My Father's House" by the Princess Irulan

georgiedenbro wrote:

Children of Dune wrote:People who served well in the corps of Farad'n, grandson of the late Shaddam IV, earned rich
promotions. One day, when the Prince was seated on his rightful throne, there
would be even greater promotions. A Bashar's rank might not be the end of it.
There were Baronies and Earldoms to be had on the many worlds of this realm . . .
once the twin Atreides were removed.

I like this offhand remark about Shaddam being dead. A little suspicious, no? He wasn't exactly a doddering old man, and in Dune, ~23 years earlier, he was described this way:

Dune wrote:My father, the Padishah Emperor, took me by the hand one day and I sensed in the
ways my mother had taught me that he was disturbed. He led me down the Hall of
Portraits to the ego-likeness of the Duke Leto Atreides. I marked the strong
resemblance between them--my father and this man in the portrait--both with
thin, elegant faces and sharp features dominated by cold eyes. "Princessdaughter,"
my father said, "I would that you'd been older when it came time for
this man to choose a woman." My father was 71 at the time and looking no older
than the man in the portrait, and I was but 14, yet I remember deducing in that
instant that my father secretly wished the Duke had been his son, and disliked
the political necessities that made them enemies.
-"In My Father's House" by the Princess Irulan

This passage must take place near or almost during the events of Dune, given Irulan's age here. At the time of Leto's death Leto was 51, and we assume he was younger still in the portrait. We can also, I think, assume that the apparent age of the spice-user is their real effective age as they benefit from the geriatric properties. So if Shaddam looked 50 or younger here (probably as if in his 40's) while actually 71 then he'd not even be close to being at extreme old age 23 years later, as that would age him another maybe 12-15 years and make him effectively in his 50's or 60.

So what's with Shaddam's early demise? Paul? Alia? Fenring? Or maybe it was Wensicia, so that Farad'n could take over the family.