Jᴀᴄᴜʀᴜᴛᴜ - Tʜᴇ Cᴀsᴛ Oᴜᴛ

I'm on holidays so can't dash to my copy of God Emperor to triple-check, but I noted something interesting on reading Chapter House the other day. And just had to raise it with people who I knew actually could care less.

When Bell and Duncan have their little showdown, Duncan reminds Bell of her ancestor, and I quote, "Tersius Helen Anteac".

I know that the Encyclopedia spells it 'Tertius Eileen Anteac' - I can't recall whether her name is spelled out (bad pun, I'm aware) in God Emperor or whether she's only ever 'Anteac'.

What exactly is going on here? Is it just some terribly poor research on someone's part? Yet it does raise, I feel, interesting thoughts about the extent of Duncan's recollection and limits of his memories. So close, 'Tersius Helen' vs 'Tertius Eileen', yet so far.

As someone remarkably new to the Dune fan universe, I do hope this hasn't been beaten to death anywhere else. Apologies if that's so.

IIRC it only ewver says Anteac in GEoD(though I'll admit I haven't search for it now, hence the "IIRC").
The DE is supposed to change facts a little, distort them a bit as it were for it to look like it's truly a work done millenia after by fallible(sp?), human historians. Or that's what I heard once.

Yes, the DE is pretending to be an "in-universe" document, meant to be distorted and incorrect in many ways. I can't search it right now, might try later if I remember.

A Thing of Eternity wrote:Yes, the DE is pretending to be an "in-universe" document, meant to be distorted and incorrect in many ways. I can't search it right now, might try later if I remember.

I really enjoyed reading the Dune Encyclopedia, largely for this reason. You really did get the feeling that it was written by in-universe historians, with history being distorted over thousands of years (and NOT purposely by Irulan). One section that stood out for me was the alternate stories of Muad'dib's life. One of the stories speculates that Paul was actually killed in the Harkonnen attack and a charismatic Fremen leader stepped up and claimed his name/title to facilitate a revolution.
There are also some stories about the young Muad'dib wandering in the desert and encountering desert demons that tested him with riddles and challenges. It reminded me of something like the Bible - it tells the stories of real people, but the stories have become distorted, and history ends up reading like fiction

Thanks!

I had a feeling it was only made clear in the Encyclopedia, and hence not canon (though far more canon than any of the 'new' Dune, in my opinion).

If that's the case, how nice of Frank to include a little nod to the Encyclopedia. That's more nods than you'll ever get, KJA.

And for great articles in the Encyclopedia, I don't think it's possible to go past the entry for Gamont. 'Suds and Bubbles' here I come!

RM Opportuniac wrote: And for great articles in the Encyclopedia, I don't think it's possible to go past the entry for Gamont. 'Suds and Bubbles' here I come!

Gamont?

Gamont the 'pleasure planet'.

The entry is made up of excerpts from the diary of a laundry Sister from Wallach IX who wins a trip (with the help of a Mentat she wins a competition featured on a box of washing powder). She's never done anything but BG laundry, so finds the planet a bit of an experience.

The currency is strings of beads. There are pictures of a young Mohiam in a swimsuit. The local RM makes a joke about 'lay sisters'. The Sister is confused by the leathergoods store - why anyone would want to whip a gentle 'thorse is beyond her.

In such a terribly serious universe, it's a welcome laugh.

Yeah...but the whole "detergent box contest" thing was just a bit too much mid/late-20th-century-Americana for me.

The fallibility of historians is an important theme, but the entries are supposed to be based on translations from Leto's "Hidden Journals", no? There should be NO errors in what he records (unless you want to admit the possibility of his intentionally falsifying his journals), only in the translations and interpretations.

The Dune Encyclopedia was published before GEoD. Dr. McNelly was given an advanced copy before work began on the DE but I'm not sure if each contributing author read it.

Anyway...

The female sense of sharing originated as familial sharing-care of the young,
the gathering and preparation of food, sharing joys, love and sorrows. Funeral
lamentation originated with women. Religion began as a female monopoly, wrested
from them only after its social power became too dominant. Women were the first
medical researchers and Practitioners. There has never been any clear balance
between the sexes because power goes with certain roles as it certainly goes
with knowledge.
-The Stolen Journals

FOR THE Reverend Mother Tertius Eileen Anteac, this had been a disastrous
morning. She had arrived on Arrakis with her fellow Truthsayer, Marcus Claire
Luyseyal, both of them coming down with their official party less than three
hours ago aboard the first shuttle from the Guild heighliner hanging in
stationary orbit. First, they had been assigned rooms at the absolute edge of
the Festival City's Embassy Quarter. The rooms were small and not quite clean.
"Any farther out and we'd be camping in the slums," Luyseyal had said.

Wow. I've since come home from my trip, but instead of checking God Emperor I've been flicking through the Encyclopedia instead. Lazy, but just that touch more fascinating.

It's a minute detail, I know, but I find the implications fascinating. Well, that and I've always liked Anteac.

RM Opportuniac wrote:It's a minute detail, I know, but I find the implications fascinating. Well, that and I've always liked Anteac.

I wish Anteac and Luyseyal had gotten more pages in GEoD, they were a great pair of characters. I think their audience with Leto II was one of the best in the series.

Freakzilla wrote:

RM Opportuniac wrote:It's a minute detail, I know, but I find the implications fascinating. Well, that and I've always liked Anteac.

I wish Anteac and Luyseyal had gotten more pages in GEoD, they were a great pair of characters. I think their audience with Leto II was one of the best in the series.

I agree...but i could also say the same about Malky...

Damn good book...

Since posting my question, and both thinking about it and reading your responses, God Emperor has taken its rightful place as equal second-favourite with Chapter House, both of which are very close behind Heretics. Didn't take much!

The Anteac/Luyseyal/Leto showdown is great, but I've always loved the what, one sentence or so revelation by Anteac of the Face Dancer invasion. "Yes". Heavens, can you imagine if BH and KJA had attempted to write that scene?

I have to go and lay down, now that I've imagined that.

RM Opportuniac wrote:Since posting my question, and both thinking about it and reading your responses, God Emperor has taken its rightful place as equal second-favourite with Chapter House, both of which are very close behind Heretics. Didn't take much!

The Anteac/Luyseyal/Leto showdown is great, but I've always loved the what, one sentence or so revelation by Anteac of the Face Dancer invasion. "Yes". Heavens, can you imagine if BH and KJA had attempted to write that scene?

I have to go and lay down, now that I've imagined that.

I was actually thinking about that scene too when I posted above. BH/KLA would have had Anteac decapitate the face dancer with a flying leg kick.

You know them too well!

The Sister is confused by the leathergoods store - why anyone would want to whip a gentle 'thorse is beyond her.

I have to admit that I LOL'ed at the name of the leather store..."Ve Haf Vays." ( as in "ve haf vays of mekking you talk.")
I also laughed at Nantucket, but I thought the song was going to be about "I once new a man from Nantucket..."

I also just realized that the Fifth Element pretty much ripped off the DE's entry for Gamont for Fhloston Paradise. Even down to the "I won the trip from a contest." (a movie incidentally produced by Gaumont... trippy.)

Anyway, I'm rambling. Have a good Tryitday.