Jᴀᴄᴜʀᴜᴛᴜ - Tʜᴇ Cᴀsᴛ Oᴜᴛ

Short intro to the BG at the start of HoD if you have a minute.

It would be a huge help if you took a moment to try that for me, I need as many real Dune people to post their intro, or at least their place in the Dune universe, at the start of HoD

... no thoughts of non FH related garbage, as if I need to ask....



Thank you

Which HoD? Be specific.

DuneFishUK wrote:Which HoD? Be specific.

really?

Sorry let me be very clear

Heretics of Dune
Author Frank Herbert

Good good.... can't be too careful these days

(tbh though - it could have been an evaluation of how things stood at the start of D7 minus those two... obviously not though)

Hunters is HuoD.

Pronounced (if at all) "Grunters".

Or like that grunt-thing the guy does in the opening theme of the old HBO show "OZ".

HUOD! Daaaa-na-na-na. HUOD! Daaa-na-na-na-naaaa!

SandChigger wrote:Hunters is HuoD.

Pronounced (if at all) "Grunters".

Or like that grunt-thing the guy does in the opening theme of the old HBO show "OZ".

HUOD! Daaaa-na-na-na. HUOD! Daaa-na-na-na-naaaa!

I know you guys will come back and post one for me right....

This has been an epic failure by me. SM = PHAIL

anyhow, here is my intro, please comment on it if you can

The BG is an all female group, dedicated to maintaining the survival of humanity. They have been responsible for various breeding programs through the millennia. They maintain influence with a vast political strength; they use sexual bonding to control males in positions of power; many of the BG agents are spread throughout the empire, using information and influence to ensure their power in order to continue their goal of preserving the human race.

(I think it was more a case of people not really being sure what you wanted. )

Isn't "control" a bit strong? Wouldn't "influence" be more accurate? The former makes them sound too much like the Honored Matres... who of course developed in part from the BG, but they weren't the same.

SwordMaster wrote:This has been an epic failure by me. SM = PHAIL

anyhow, here is my intro, please comment on it if you can

The BG is an all female group, dedicated to maintaining the survival of humanity. They have been responsible for various breeding programs through the millennia. They maintain influence with a vast political strength; they use sexual bonding to control males in positions of power; many of the BG agents are spread throughout the empire, using information and influence to ensure their power in order to continue their goal of preserving the human race.

change this to influence?

I'm not sure the BG main objective was human survival. Leto chastises them in his carvings at Sietch Tabr, saying they saw the need for the GP but didn't act.

Up until the Atreides Dynasty, I think they were more into the evolution of humanity. They hoped to breed a superman to save humanity for them.

Afterwards, the ONLY objective was survival of The Sisterhood.

Freakzilla wrote:I'm not sure the BG main objective was human survival. Leto chastises them in his carvings at Sietch Tabr, saying they saw the need for the GP but didn't act.

Up until the Atreides Dynasty, I think they were more into the evolution of humanity. They hoped to breed a superman to save humanity for them.

Afterwards, the ONLY objective was survival of The Sisterhood.

Did they operate under the false guise of safe guarding humanty then?

SwordMaster wrote:

Freakzilla wrote:I'm not sure the BG main objective was human survival. Leto chastises them in his carvings at Sietch Tabr, saying they saw the need for the GP but didn't act.

Up until the Atreides Dynasty, I think they were more into the evolution of humanity. They hoped to breed a superman to save humanity for them.

Afterwards, the ONLY objective was survival of The Sisterhood.

Did they operate under the false guise of safe guarding humanty then?

First, you'll have to provide a quote saying that is what they were doing.

They were practicing politics in the guise of teachers, which should be a lesson in itself to us all.

Their whole "greater purpose" was a secret, wasn't it? Didn't they act as advisers, and rent out their powers to leaders, etc. Rent-a-witch?

Edited to add: What Freak said

HBJ

Of course, one of their main services was truthsaying, which I'm sure was a great front for a spy, just think of the influence RM Mohiam had on Shaddam IV, not to mention his audience.

They also obviously provided "finished" young women to Royal Houses wich worked out nicely with their breeding program.

They also acted as arbitrators, the political benifits there are obvious, too.

For some reason when I think of the BG as a whole I can't help but imagine them as nothing more than children playing in Leto's sandbox.

Freakzilla wrote:

SwordMaster wrote:

Freakzilla wrote:I'm not sure the BG main objective was human survival. Leto chastises them in his carvings at Sietch Tabr, saying they saw the need for the GP but didn't act.

Up until the Atreides Dynasty, I think they were more into the evolution of humanity. They hoped to breed a superman to save humanity for them.

Afterwards, the ONLY objective was survival of The Sisterhood.

Did they operate under the false guise of safe guarding humanty then?

First, you'll have to provide a quote saying that is what they were doing.

They were practicing politics in the guise of teachers, which should be a lesson in itself to us all.

Looking for quotes right now, in relation to the KH and I think they were more interested in Power then Humanity.

Some quotes from Chapterhouse:

"You're farmers," he said. "That's what you Bene Gesserit really do."
She saw immediately what had happened, Mentat training coming out in him without his knowing. Best not explore that yet. "We are concerned with everything that grows, Miles. It was perceptive of you to see this."

Bell said there were no limits beyond which the Sisterhood would refuse to go in preserving the Bene Gesserit. A modicum of truth in this boast but it was the truth of all boasting. There were indeed things a Reverend Mother would not do to save the Sisterhood.
We would not block the Tyrant's Golden Path.
Survival of humankind took precedence over survival of the Sisterhood. Else our grail of human maturity is meaningless.

The Bene Gesserit's secret purpose was that: to mature humanity. They believed that Leto preserved them for this purpose, because they alone hold the key to humanity's past in their Other Memory. No one else has the thread of connection to a common past, and no one else has quite the understanding of humanity that they have.

Phaedrus wrote:Some quotes from Chapterhouse:

"You're farmers," he said. "That's what you Bene Gesserit really do."
She saw immediately what had happened, Mentat training coming out in him without his knowing. Best not explore that yet. "We are concerned with everything that grows, Miles. It was perceptive of you to see this."

Bell said there were no limits beyond which the Sisterhood would refuse to go in preserving the Bene Gesserit. A modicum of truth in this boast but it was the truth of all boasting. There were indeed things a Reverend Mother would not do to save the Sisterhood.
We would not block the Tyrant's Golden Path.
Survival of humankind took precedence over survival of the Sisterhood. Else our grail of human maturity is meaningless.

The Bene Gesserit's secret purpose was that: to mature humanity. They believed that Leto preserved them for this purpose, because they alone hold the key to humanity's past in their Other Memory. No one else has the thread of connection to a common past, and no one else has quite the understanding of humanity that they have.

Is it me, or this is not apparent in GEoD? The BG seem to feel like they are prisoners of Leto's regime (i.e. He stopped their breeding program,cut the spice, etc). Is this a realization they made only in HoD or before?

Rakis wrote:

Phaedrus wrote:Some quotes from Chapterhouse:

"You're farmers," he said. "That's what you Bene Gesserit really do."
She saw immediately what had happened, Mentat training coming out in him without his knowing. Best not explore that yet. "We are concerned with everything that grows, Miles. It was perceptive of you to see this."

Bell said there were no limits beyond which the Sisterhood would refuse to go in preserving the Bene Gesserit. A modicum of truth in this boast but it was the truth of all boasting. There were indeed things a Reverend Mother would not do to save the Sisterhood.
We would not block the Tyrant's Golden Path.
Survival of humankind took precedence over survival of the Sisterhood. Else our grail of human maturity is meaningless.

The Bene Gesserit's secret purpose was that: to mature humanity. They believed that Leto preserved them for this purpose, because they alone hold the key to humanity's past in their Other Memory. No one else has the thread of connection to a common past, and no one else has quite the understanding of humanity that they have.

Is it me, or this is not apparent in GEoD? The BG seem to feel like they are prisoners of Leto's regime (i.e. He stopped their breeding program,cut the spice, etc). Is this a realization they made only in HoD or before?

No quotes from before, it seems that LetoII did change the sisterhood, I would imagine before it was only about their own survival, once Leto began the golden path, they got out of its way.

In HoD and CH:D, NOTHING is more important to a BG that survival of The Sisterhood. They just had to get back into mainstream humanity.

Freakzilla wrote:In HoD and CH:D, NOTHING is more important to a BG that survival of The Sisterhood. They just had to get back into mainstream humanity.

This got me thinking, the devide in the BG about the Duncan ghola and obviously, the chance of interfearence with eth GP, is that at the core of the fued within the sisterhood, the BG civil war based on "survival of the BG vs. maintaining the GP" ?

Is that too much of a stretch?

I understood the feud to be whether or not another Kwisatz Haderach would be created by accident, thus renewing the restrictions on the Bene Gesserit. That was their utmost fear. Cf. the careful watch on people like Odrade.

SadisticCynic wrote:I understood the feud to be whether or not another Kwisatz Haderach would be created by accident, thus renewing the restrictions on the Bene Gesserit. That was their utmost fear. Cf. the careful watch on people like Odrade.

Did they fear another KH because it would interfear with the GP?

They didn't want to be enslaved the way Leto enslaved them so I suppose that is part of the unfolding of the Golden Path; Leto's Peace makes everyone want to break away.

They were afraid of what another Kwisatz Haderach could do to the Universe.

SadisticCynic wrote:They didn't want to be enslaved the way Leto enslaved them so I suppose that is part of the unfolding of the Golden Path; Leto's Peace makes everyone want to break away.

They were afraid of what another Kwisatz Haderach could do to the Universe.

And that is brake the GP. I think we are saying the same thing here, they were even concerned that Sheeana would disturb what was left of Leto in the worms.