Jᴀᴄᴜʀᴜᴛᴜ - Tʜᴇ Cᴀsᴛ Oᴜᴛ

Beef and Pork will only be for the rich when the EPA gets their "Cow Fart Tax" passed.

I hate environment nazis.

Freakzilla wrote:Beef and Pork will only be for the rich when the EPA gets their "Cow Fart Tax" passed.

I hate environment nazis.

We need to drastically reduce meat consumption for many reasons, not just environmenalism, though that is a serious part of the issue. Health, politics, morality, global poverty, the deforestation of the rainforest in Brazil, global warming (even if you dispute this one it's just one thing on a long list), the extreme disruption of the food chain in the oceans, the list can go on.

I'm no vegitarian, but cutting our meat consumption in half, or better yet down to a third, would do wonders for the West. We'd all be richer, healthier and happier.

If Asia (who eat meat in smaller portions, but just about as frequently as us) and India (2/3 of India is vegitarian, and many of those people are vegan, and none of India eats beef at all) decide to start eating more meat this planet is toast. Big time.

I don't doubt that some invironmental issues have validity, but taxing a farmer up to $175 per head for cow farts is just silly.

I'm too poor to eat beef regularly as it is. God, I'd love a big juicy steak.

Besides, what ever happened to personal responsibility?

Why don't we just tax fat people more? They consume more, therefore trucks and ships use more fuel to deliver to them, etc... Their cars have to work harder to move them the same distance as fit people... they drive healthcare cost up...

TAX THE FAT!

How about cutting out the fat rather than taxing it? The government is the fattest slob on the planet. Time to put our government on a diet!

Freakzilla wrote:I don't doubt that some invironmental issues have validity, but taxing a farmer up to $175 per head for cow farts is just silly.

I'm too poor to eat beef regularly as it is. God, I'd love a big juicy steak.

Besides, what ever happened to personal responsibility?

Why don't we just tax fat people more? They consume more, therefore trucks and ships use more fuel to deliver to them, etc... Their cars have to work harder to move them the same distance as fit people... they drive healthcare cost up...

TAX THE FAT!

There you go, but just like smoking and drinking, you have to tax the goods themselves in order to target those who are over consuming them, you can't just point at people and assume they're the problem. I hate luxury taxes as much as anyone (I moved to BC from Alberta to find ridiculous booze taxes, then moved back 2 years later to find even more ridiculous booze taxes in place!), but sometimes they just need to be done. I'd support luxury taxes on beef and tobacco much more than taxes that effect both the responsible and irresponsible equally.

Personal responsibility isn't in the vocabulary of this continent.

The only problem I have with luxury taxes is what happens when people stop doing it.

For instance, here in the US taxes on cigarettes go towards health care for children, or something like that. The problem is, a congressman doctor proposed making smoking illegal and the uproar from the health care nazis was deafening.

Will somebody please think of the children?

Even IF smoking went away, do you think they'd just stop that service? HEEEEEEEELLL no,they'd move that tax onto something else. Then it's no longer a luxury tax, it's just paying for crack babies.

Freakzilla wrote:The only problem I have with luxury taxes is what happens when people stop doing it.

For instance, here in the US taxes on cigarettes go towards health care for children, or something like that. The problem is, a congressman doctor proposed making smoking illegal and the uproar from the health care nazis was deafening.

Will somebody please think of the children?

Even IF smoking went away, do you think they'd just stop that service? HEEEEEEEELLL no,they'd move that tax onto something else. Then it's no longer a luxury tax, it's just paying for crack babies.

I agree with you totally that it's a bad thing when our gov's need those taxes to lean on. But I do have one great replacement for tobacco taxes.












Weed taxes.

A Thing of Eternity wrote:

Freakzilla wrote:The only problem I have with luxury taxes is what happens when people stop doing it.

For instance, here in the US taxes on cigarettes go towards health care for children, or something like that. The problem is, a congressman doctor proposed making smoking illegal and the uproar from the health care nazis was deafening.

Will somebody please think of the children?

Even IF smoking went away, do you think they'd just stop that service? HEEEEEEEELLL no,they'd move that tax onto something else. Then it's no longer a luxury tax, it's just paying for crack babies.

I agree with you totally that it's a bad thing when our gov's need those taxes to lean on. But I do have one great replacement for tobacco taxes.












Weed taxes.

Many US States already tax it (including mine): http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/MISC/ct/mjtax.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

But I understand what you're saying. That's one I'd have no problem paying too.

I'm part of an endangered species, formerly known as moderate

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:How about cutting out the fat rather than taxing it? The government is the fattest slob on the planet. Time to put our government on a diet!

dude you're such a conservative! i love it lol.
did you know that in Ontario we're up to over half a million regulations. that's half a million activities that I have to fill out paperwork for and get some government bureaucrat to approve before I can do it legally. and they wonder why Ontario has become a have-not province and the pity of confederation?!?!!?!

Half a million only? You guys gotta start letting your legislatures come in full time. You got nothin on CA.

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:I'm part of an endangered species, formerly known as moderate

you say that... but deep down you're small-c conservative
just wait and see

Can I be radically moderate?

Freakzilla wrote:

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:I'm part of an endangered species, formerly known as moderate

you say that... but deep down you're small-c conservative
just wait and see

Can I be radically moderate?

Sure, here's your motto:

"All things in moderation! (Including moderation)"

Freakzilla wrote:

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:I'm part of an endangered species, formerly known as moderate

you say that... but deep down you're small-c conservative
just wait and see

Can I be radically moderate?

That's what I call myself, radical center.

Matches well with my little brother being an extremist atheist!

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:I'm part of an endangered species, formerly known as moderate

you say that... but deep down you're small-c conservative
just wait and see

"If I'm your mission BB, best stop while you're ahead. You're welcome on my boat; conservatism ain't."

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:I'm part of an endangered species, formerly known as moderate

you say that... but deep down you're small-c conservative
just wait and see

"If I'm your mission BB, best stop while you're ahead. You're welcome on my boat; conservatism ain't."

ok so in your "moderate-ism" how do you vote? does it change from election to election based on issues and current party stances? lots of moderates simply turn out to be soft Liberal voters who usually vote that way assuming the party represents their views.

Just admit it, you vote for their hair, too.

Freakzilla wrote:

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:I'm part of an endangered species, formerly known as moderate

you say that... but deep down you're small-c conservative
just wait and see

"If I'm your mission BB, best stop while you're ahead. You're welcome on my boat; conservatism ain't."

ok so in your "moderate-ism" how do you vote? does it change from election to election based on issues and current party stances? lots of moderates simply turn out to be soft Liberal voters who usually vote that way assuming the party represents their views.

Just admit it, you vote for their hair, too.

That's what i do...

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:I'm part of an endangered species, formerly known as moderate

you say that... but deep down you're small-c conservative
just wait and see

"If I'm your mission BB, best stop while you're ahead. You're welcome on my boat; conservatism ain't."

ok so in your "moderate-ism" how do you vote? does it change from election to election based on issues and current party stances? lots of moderates simply turn out to be soft Liberal voters who usually vote that way assuming the party represents their views.

Well, since you asked so nicely without obvious ulterior motive...
I've never belonged to any political party and accept the party system only as an "unnecessary" evil. Generally, I am ideologically left and fiscally right. On those Political Compass tests I am almost dead center between right and left, but apparently an extreme libertarian (what a bunch of crap!)

When I vote, I tend to vote on issues and most importantly on reforms. I believe in people, not institutions, so I never offer blanket support to some party because they mostly follow my views (a feat that no political party has ever achieved anyway). I've voted Reform, Conservative, Liberal and independent in Federal, Provincial and Municipal elections. I honestly couldn't say if right or left parties received most of my votes and really could care less to know. Politically, I've never been happy. Alberta is disgustingly conservative, Ontario is disgustingly liberal and they both suck just as hard. I am a strong supporter of democracy but I'm convinced beyond a doubt that there is no place on this planet where the government has my interests at heart.

But if you need a "victory" I will say this; provincially, Ralph Klein was the "most" happy I ever was with a politician. Federally, I was most happy with Paul Martin. On any level, I hate the NDP

Next election I'm planning to do a write in. The "candidate"? Who ever is in charge of IKEA. Fuck does that place run efficiently, I doubt there's a single square inch of their physical locations nor business plan that hasn't been gone over with a fine toothed comb to remove wasted expendature.

Can you imagine what those people could do running our country?

GamePlayer wrote:

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:

Baraka Bryan wrote:

GamePlayer wrote:I'm part of an endangered species, formerly known as moderate

you say that... but deep down you're small-c conservative
just wait and see

"If I'm your mission BB, best stop while you're ahead. You're welcome on my boat; conservatism ain't."

ok so in your "moderate-ism" how do you vote? does it change from election to election based on issues and current party stances? lots of moderates simply turn out to be soft Liberal voters who usually vote that way assuming the party represents their views.

Well, since you asked so nicely without obvious ulterior motive...
I've never belonged to any political party and accept the party system only as an "unnecessary" evil. Generally, I am ideologically left and fiscally right. On those Political Compass tests I am almost dead center between right and left, but apparently an extreme libertarian (what a bunch of crap!)

When I vote, I tend to vote on issues and most importantly on reforms. I believe in people, not institutions, so I never offer blanket support to some party because they mostly follow my views (a feat that no political party has ever achieved anyway). I've voted Reform, Conservative, Liberal and independent in Federal, Provincial and Municipal elections. I honestly couldn't say if right or left parties received most of my votes and really could care less to know. Politically, I've never been happy. Alberta is disgustingly conservative, Ontario is disgustingly liberal and they both suck just as hard. I am a strong supporter of democracy but I'm convinced beyond a doubt that there is no place on this planet where the government has my interests at heart.

But if you need a "victory" I will say this; provincially, Ralph Klein was the "most" happy I ever was with a politician. Federally, I was most happy with Paul Martin. On any level, I hate the NDP

Hah, pretty much how I feel - but I hated Klein. Respected that he was straight up, but was disgusted with his BS treatment of farmers and BS stances on animal rights. As well as his BS stance on gay marriage.

Vote National Radical Meadow Party in 2012!

Baraka Bryan wrote:well at least we have some common ground then as far as Liberal leaders have gone, I disliked Martin the least. He was fiscally conservative and really did good things as finance minister. he inherited a problem as PM and it sunk him, but he wasn't too bad.

I warned you I was annoying, but noooo, you didn't believe me

A Thing of Eternity wrote:Hah, pretty much how I feel - but I hated Klein. Respected that he was straight up, but was disgusted with his BS treatment of farmers and BS stances on animal rights. As well as his BS stance on gay marriage.

It's a universal law that we will forever be damned with worthless politicians that we almost completely despise on every level. If I agree with as little as 5% of what a politician stands for, I consider that a great achievement of epically heroic proportions. I think if I ever agreed with 10% of what a politician stands for, I'd fall in love with them, rape them and then the universe would explode

GamePlayer wrote:

A Thing of Eternity wrote:Hah, pretty much how I feel - but I hated Klein. Respected that he was straight up, but was disgusted with his BS treatment of farmers and BS stances on animal rights. As well as his BS stance on gay marriage.

It's a universal law that we will forever be damned with worthless politicians that we almost completely despise on every level. If I agree with as little as 5% of what a politician stands for, I consider that a great achievement of epically heroic proportions. I think if I ever agreed with 10% of what a politician stands for, I'd fall in love with them, rape them and then the universe would explode

Wonderfully put.


I unfortunately have always felt that the only way to even remotely participate in democracy was to vote, not for who I liked the most, but whoever I was least afraid of at the time. I've only ever voted Liberal, and then later NDP (though neither part gets many points from me), but if I'd been voting age at the time of the PCs I might have voted for them in federal elections sometimes.

When the Naz-err... I mean Alliance party re-joined the Conservative party that was the end of me ever voting for them. I guess it's not totally impossible, hell, I'd vote for Bush if the other option was Hussien, but the other partys (and I mean ALL the other parties) would have to each do something absolutely evil for me to vote C, or the fundies would have to leave the party again.

It really doesn't matter if you agree with where a politician stands because that changes depending on who they're talking to and whether it's before or after the election.

Talk is cheap... except in Congress.

Freakzilla wrote:It really doesn't matter if you agree with where a politician stands because that changes depending on who they're talking to and whether it's before or after the election.

Talk is cheap... except in Congress.

But we do get to try and guess what they're going to do based on their BS, and their party's history! Wee fun times with spin the wheel democracy!

Me: I'll take "Two-Faced Cheating Bastards" for $1,000, Alex.
Alex Trebek: You get, the Daily Double!