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    Whipping Star

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      Non-Dune Frank Herbert Book Discussion

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    Whipping Star

    Postby Mr. Teg » 13 Mar 2008 08:36

    The first of two books set in the Consentiency with Jorj X. Mackie of BuSab or The Bureau of Sabotage.

    (The Dosadi Experiment was the second book but doesn't matter which you read first. There are also two short stories published in later anthologies titled, "A matter of Traces" and "The Tactful Saboteur" with Jorj X. Mackie.)
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    Postby SandChigger » 13 Mar 2008 09:06

    I wanna sue Kevin in a Gowachin court! And find him innocent!

    GOOD EATS! :twisted:

    (Well, probably not, but this is fiction, right?)


    I reread Dosadi a few summers back, but couldn't find my copy of Whipping Star at the time. I first read both as an undergrad. I thought that, for me, Dosadi stood the test of time. :)
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    Postby orald » 13 Mar 2008 16:52

    I'm currently reading Dosadi for the first time, and I think you still need to read Whipping Star first to understand some things.
    Also, the ConSentiency series is more properly started by the short story The Tactful Saboteur, where we meet with McKie, Bildoon(more relevant to that and WS than Dosadi) and several aspects of the various spicies and organizations.

    I think P&B are in the same creche and KJA got himself ego-frozen. :P
    In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.

    I wish I could have been with you that one last time.
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    Postby Freakzilla » 13 Mar 2008 17:21

    Was that in Eye? I can't remember, I read it so long ago.
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    Postby orald » 13 Mar 2008 18:04

    If you're refering to Tactful Saboteur, then I think it was. Anyway, it's in that package of books I sent you, in the ConSentiency folder.
    In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.

    I wish I could have been with you that one last time.
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    Postby Freakzilla » 13 Mar 2008 18:55

    Right on!
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    Postby Mr. Teg » 13 Mar 2008 22:52

    orald wrote:I'm currently reading Dosadi for the first time, and I think you still need to read Whipping Star first to understand some things.


    It was late when I typed the first post, and now that I am more awake with several cups of coffee...

    Dosadi isn't really a sequel, but a new case. So, I think it can be enjoyed by itself without having read Whipping Star, but with that said I agree you should read Whipping Star before Dosadi to get the relationship between McKie and the Caleban, Fanny Mae.

    I think P&B are in the same creche and KJA got himself ego-frozen. :P


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    Postby A Thing of Eternity » 09 Apr 2008 16:59

    I actually read Dosadi first, and then Whipping Star. Worked out good for me, but it wasn't exactly on purpose. Kinda ruined the big surprise in Whipping... but hey, I have a bad habit of getting partway through a book and finding out that it's a sequel.
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    Postby orald » 09 Apr 2008 19:07

    I try to make it a habbit to check the page where all the editions, credits, publishers etc are on to see if it's part of some bigger series.
    In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.

    I wish I could have been with you that one last time.
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    Postby A Thing of Eternity » 09 Apr 2008 19:13

    I haven't learned that trick yet, I just started Richard Morgan's Broken Angels... second book in a series. Damn. One of these day's I'll get there.
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    Postby Tleilax Master B » 06 May 2008 12:56

    I'm reading whipping star now, and its pretty good so far. I've noticed there are a number of Dune references in it. Some for things that had not occurred yet (I think this was right after Dune Messiah, no?) such as chairdogs. And some references that have occurred already, including "galach".
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    Postby A Thing of Eternity » 06 May 2008 13:31

    Tleilax Master B wrote:I'm reading whipping star now, and its pretty good so far. I've noticed there are a number of Dune references in it. Some for things that had not occurred yet (I think this was right after Dune Messiah, no?) such as chairdogs. And some references that have occurred already, including "galach".

    I personnally felt that the chairdogs/beds suited the ConSentiency series of books much more than the Dune series. They're just a bit whimsical for the Dune books in my opinion. Whipping Star was one of my Favorite books, though I accidently read the Dosadi Experiment first so it ruined the ending a bit.
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    Postby Freakzilla » 06 May 2008 13:43

    A Thing of Eternity wrote:
    Tleilax Master B wrote:I'm reading whipping star now, and its pretty good so far. I've noticed there are a number of Dune references in it. Some for things that had not occurred yet (I think this was right after Dune Messiah, no?) such as chairdogs. And some references that have occurred already, including "galach".

    I personnally felt that the chairdogs/beds suited the ConSentiency series of books much more than the Dune series. They're just a bit whimsical for the Dune books in my opinion. Whipping Star was one of my Favorite books, though I accidently read the Dosadi Experiment first so it ruined the ending a bit.


    I think FH liked to throw things into the Duniverse just to validate it being science fiction.
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    Postby orald » 06 May 2008 13:51

    I think chairdogs, FDs and gholas/clones are made to show the BT's lack of caring for what we'd call respect for life.
    When you can make life from scratch like the BT can and understand their inner workings so well, it's hard to respect it.

    Look at sligs- distasteful hybrids, and later futars that go byond tinkering with the human form within the human range(FDs) into the other species(i.e cats).

    Then you have Teg who resents chairdog usage because it humiliates life(IIRC), and Teg is nothing if not what FH would call honorable and "good".
    In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.

    I wish I could have been with you that one last time.
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    Wonder if brian Herbert would....

    Postby trang » 06 May 2008 19:26

    I luved whipping star and Dosadi, and the character Jorge Mckie is great. There is so much that could be done with this series its yet it just sits there.

    I know brian herbert is working with KJA on other dune additions (which really arnt necessary), but would be interesting to see Brian, drop KJA and take this ball on his own.

    The adventures of Jorge Mckie and BuSab! Tales written inbetween WS and DE, or before WS would have have plenty of legs and I think be fun.

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    Postby orald » 07 May 2008 05:39

    Oh God no! :shock:
    In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.

    I wish I could have been with you that one last time.
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    Re: Wonder if brian Herbert would....

    Postby SandChigger » 07 May 2008 07:33

    trang wrote:[it] would be interesting to see Brian, drop KJA and take this ball on his own.

    I think we would all love to see Brian drop KJA.

    I'd like to see someone drop kick KJA.

    Even more, I'd like to see Nebiros and Fatomas' Big Sky Daddy drop a boulder on KJA.

    But for tonight I take solace in the fact that I still have more hair than KJA.

    :D
    I have heard of only one mistake that doesn’t have an explanation for a careful reader...with an open mind. (And, no, I’m not going to tell you what it is!) —KJA

    I don't like every writer's style; for instance, I have never been able to get through Ursula LeGuin, China Mieville, or Iain Banks, all of whom are critical darlings. —KJA

    I...had written a bunch of Star Wars and X-Files books...that proved not just that I'm a hack, but that I could write in somebody else's universe... —KJA
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    Re: Wonder if brian Herbert would....

    Postby orald » 07 May 2008 10:33

    SandChigger wrote:But for tonight I take solace in the fact that I still have more hair than KJA.

    :D

    And you also have less money and fame than KJA, so hah!

    *Bows before an alter to KJA's glory*

    Appearantly KJA hasn't taken his master's tip to the heart- instead of starting his own religion he writes(err, dictates) even more books for a penny a word. :wink:
    In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.

    I wish I could have been with you that one last time.
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    Re: Wonder if brian Herbert would....

    Postby SandChigger » 07 May 2008 18:27

    orald wrote:And you also have less money and fame than KJA, so hah!

    So...I pay less taxes and can move more freely through crowds. :D

    I also have no trouble looking myself in the mirror or sleeping at night.

    Not that I imagine he has any trouble doing either, either, mind you.

    That would imply he had a conscience. ;)
    I have heard of only one mistake that doesn’t have an explanation for a careful reader...with an open mind. (And, no, I’m not going to tell you what it is!) —KJA

    I don't like every writer's style; for instance, I have never been able to get through Ursula LeGuin, China Mieville, or Iain Banks, all of whom are critical darlings. —KJA

    I...had written a bunch of Star Wars and X-Files books...that proved not just that I'm a hack, but that I could write in somebody else's universe... —KJA
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    Re: Wonder if brian Herbert would....

    Postby inhuien » 08 May 2008 05:47

    SandChigger wrote:
    orald wrote:And you also have less money and fame than KJA, so hah!

    So...I pay less taxes and can move more freely through crowds. :D

    I also have no trouble looking myself in the mirror or sleeping at night.

    Not that I imagine he has any trouble doing either, either, mind you.

    That would imply he had a conscience. ;)

    You beat me to it, that was my reaction to Oralds words as well. Our only hope now is he (KJA) develops multiple Personality disorder and that one can't handle the shame and Jumps.........................



    KER SPLATT!!
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    Re: Wonder if brian Herbert would....

    Postby orald » 08 May 2008 06:01

    inhuien wrote:Our only hope now is he (KJA) develops multiple Personality disorder and that one can't handle the shame and Jumps.........................



    KER SPLATT!!

    Given the connection, shouldn't we hope for a possession and KJA jumping to his death to end it?
    Though that would imply he wouldn't like to share his mind with his evilest of ancestors...which doesn't make much sense IMO. :?
    In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.

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    Postby Tleilax Master B » 22 May 2008 22:00

    Back on topic...

    I'm almost finished with Whipping Star. Its been pretty good. Its certainly doesn't hold my attention as much as the Dune books, but still good.
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    Postby A Thing of Eternity » 22 May 2008 22:25

    Writing style is closer to D:V than Dune.
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    Postby Tleilax Master B » 22 May 2008 22:29

    A Thing of Eternity wrote:Writing style is closer to D:V than Dune.

    I'm ashamed to admit I haven't read Destination Void either :oops:

    But, it is on the list. Its about time for my yearly run through the Dune series again :wink:
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    Postby A Thing of Eternity » 22 May 2008 23:15

    D:V actually hurts a little bit to read. Good book, just uh, painful at points.
    You've read the rest of the Pandora books though right?
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