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    Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby ehhnn » 07 Aug 2015 04:39

    Hi,

    First post, hope this is in the proper space and hasn't been addressed recently.

    When the Atreides moved to Arrakis from Caladan, they must have brought the family atomics with them if they were essentially making it their primary fief. Paul uses them to blow a hole in the shield wall, so he, Gurney, or Jessica must have known their location on the planet. They couldn't have been too far from Arrakeen since the great houses hadn't explored the supposedly uninhabitable southern regions, and they were able to bring them to the shield wall without too much difficulty or detection.

    Did Rabban search for them? Did any Harkonnen agents? Even if the Baron thought all Atreides to be dead after the raid, I doubt he would have ignored the matter of the Atreides family atomics, since it would be any potential survivor's main leverage against him.

    Been thinking about this for a while and would appreciate others' input.
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    Re: Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby georgiedenbro » 07 Aug 2015 09:56

    Dune wrote:"We will depend upon ourselves," he [Paul] said. "Our immediate concern is our family atomics. We must get them before the Harkonnens can search them out."
    "Not likely they'll be found," she said, "the way they were hidden."
    "It must not be left to chance."
    And she thought: Blackmail with the family atomics as a threat to the planet and its spice--that's what he has in mind. But all he can hope for then is escape into renegade anonymity.


    Two points: 1) Paul acknowledges that the Harkonnens will look for them. 2) They are well hidden, most likely not just buried under an X by a tree.

    More broadly, though, I believe FH only included in the book that which was essential to the story, and a subplot about a failed Harkonnen search for the atomics would not have led to anything. So I agree with you that the Harkonnens surely initiated a search for the atomics, but I also think there was no reason to include that in the book.
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    Re: Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby D Pope » 08 Aug 2015 17:37

    georgiedenbro wrote:...but I also think there was no reason to include that in the book.

    I would like to have read about that little diversion. How long would it have taken for
    Paul to tell Stilgar about his immediate concern? What criteria had to be met before
    Paul decided to trust Stilgar? What kind of mission would it take to secure the nukes?

    On the other hand, do you think Gurney knew their whereabouts? Myself, I doubt it.
    I think Gurney would have used them if he'd known.
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    Re: Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby Freakzilla » 09 Aug 2015 05:02

    D Pope wrote:On the other hand, do you think Gurney knew their whereabouts? Myself, I doubt it.
    I think Gurney would have used them if he'd known.


    I don't know about that, everyone seemed horrified at the idea of Paul using them on the shield wall. Duncan, maybe... if he'd lived.
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    Re: Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby D Pope » 09 Aug 2015 13:05

    With the already hated Harkonnens having just 'killed' all the Atreides, I could see Gurney
    flipping out and going all suicide bomber. Then again, remembering his conversation to secure
    a spot with the smugglers, he might be more the type to take such an order than give it.


    By the way, well done ehhnn! Good question! Looking forward to seeing your post in the
    "Introduce Yourself!" forum.
    Leto II is gone for good, except for OM. The "pearl" was just that; a miniscule portion of what Leto was, and not a compressed version of the whole. The pearl that the worms have do not make them Leto, or in any way similar to him.
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    Re: Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby inhuien » 11 Aug 2015 03:59

    Perhaps it's cause I'm due a reread. Was it true atomics or lasgun/sheild reaction that bleu out the sheild wall?
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    Re: Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby Freakzilla » 11 Aug 2015 05:40

    inhuien wrote:Perhaps it's cause I'm due a reread. Was it true atomics or lasgun/sheild reaction that bleu out the sheild wall?


    It was the Atreides House Atomics.

    Duncan did set up a large shield in the desert when the Harkonnens were hunting them with lasguns from thopters which caused an atomic explosion.
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    Re: Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby inhuien » 11 Aug 2015 06:37

    Freakzilla wrote:
    inhuien wrote:Perhaps it's cause I'm due a reread. Was it true atomics or lasgun/sheild reaction that bleu out the sheild wall?


    It was the Atreides House Atomics.

    Duncan did set up a large shield in the desert when the Harkonnens were hunting them with lasguns from thopters which caused an atomic explosion.


    Thanks for the confirmation:) was there also a cache left with smugglers or am I thinking of Ulysses 31.

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    Re: Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby lotek » 14 Aug 2015 09:58

    OFF TOPIC
    Ulysse 31 is a cartoon that makes me proud of French animation (well the Japanese helped, but on their own they would just have made a big mess of mythology like Saint Seyia)

    BACK ON TOPIC
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    Re: Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby Deskepticon » 29 Aug 2015 01:19

    I seem to remember Gurney cautioning Paul against the use of Atomics. Not likely he'd go on a rampage with them.

    Also, can't remember if it was Gurney or Duncan, but someone is talking to Paul about them. Paraphrasing, Paul says they must retrieve the Family Atomics. Person replies with "unless the Harkonnens have found them." Paul: "The way they were hidden?" leaving the question open as if to say "Not likely!" ( <-- that quote might actually be in the book, now that I think about it).

    It's one of those things that's briefly mentioned, then brushed off because it's not that important to the overall story. Like how sandworms are "oxygen factories" to explain how a desert planet can sustain human life, but then never details the bio-chemical reactions that actually take place within the worm to produce the oxygen.
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    Re: Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby Freakzilla » 30 Aug 2015 07:56

    Deskepticon wrote:I seem to remember Gurney cautioning Paul against the use of Atomics. Not likely he'd go on a rampage with them.

    Also, can't remember if it was Gurney or Duncan, but someone is talking to Paul about them. Paraphrasing, Paul says they must retrieve the Family Atomics. Person replies with "unless the Harkonnens have found them." Paul: "The way they were hidden?" leaving the question open as if to say "Not likely!" ( <-- that quote might actually be in the book, now that I think about it).


    It was quoted by georgiedenbro a few posts up.
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    Re: Atomics on Arrakis

    Postby D Pope » 02 Sep 2015 17:18

    Gurneys objection was based on the fact that he could see a future now, for Paul, and himself.
    He was worried about being held accountable for a crime, after winning the battle. He's also
    the guy who was ready to trade his life for the death of Beast Rabban. I still think he'd have
    nuked Arrakeen without a second thought if it meant the end of House Harkonnen. Gurney
    only became a smuggler because it gave him the best opportunity to kill his enemy.
    Leto II is gone for good, except for OM. The "pearl" was just that; a miniscule portion of what Leto was, and not a compressed version of the whole. The pearl that the worms have do not make them Leto, or in any way similar to him.
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