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A Thing of Eternity
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More FAQ Bull

Postby A Thing of Eternity » 29 May 2008 16:49

Bored again.
Q: In the preludes Jessica is almost forced on Duke Leto. Yet in the DUNE classic, we read that the Duke actually sent buyers to purchase her.

A: The Leto/Jessica meeting scene in HOUSE HARKONNEN was actually written by Frank Herbert himself and found in his notes. The events shown in HOUSE HARKONNEN are consistent with the original notes.

Sure it was :wink:. If it actually was in his notes then he decided it didn't belong in the real story because it conflicted with how he wanted Leto and Jessica's relationship to be understood by the reader.
Q:How are ships powered in the Butlerian Jihad timeframe? Are they using faster-than-light travel? How can a galactic empire hold together if it takes a month for messages to be sent from world to world?

A:The League ships are faster-than-light, but still vastly slower than the near-instantaneous foldspace ships later used by the Guild. Travel between star systems still takes weeks or months. It's the comparative difference between crossing the Atlantic in a sailing ship or on the Concorde. However, historical vast empires -- such as the Roman Empire and the British Empire -- operated successfully even under such constraints.

I think we all know this is one of my personal favorites. They don't even answer the first (and only intelligent) part of the question. Goofs.
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Postby The Sons of Idaho » 29 May 2008 17:04

Wait, they actually do claim that the ships are faster than light??
How simple things were when our messiah was only a dream...

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Postby Tleilax Master B » 29 May 2008 17:10

Yeah, if Frank deliberately did not include something--THAN NEITHER SHOULD YOU HACKS.

Most importantly, for some clarification, Kevin later said that it was in fact in Frank's stuff that he wrote that scene--FOR THE DAVID LYNCH MOVIE. The scene was left on the cutting room floor (or not filmed at all, I can't remember) and thus was never used. It was never intended to be in any of the books.......
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Postby GamePlayer » 29 May 2008 17:51

The reason and the explanation for the FTL are both expected and utterly worthless. I love the non-answers that these two fuck ups give. This is like what, example number...whatever, that these two idiots have answered a question by not answering it. :roll: They should be in public office.

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A Thing of Eternity
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Postby A Thing of Eternity » 29 May 2008 17:56

The Sons of Idaho wrote:Wait, they actually do claim that the ships are faster than light??


Even if they hadn't outright said it, the travel times between star systems in the Legends series prove that they were using FTL.
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SandChigger
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FROM THE HACK HIMSELF

Postby SandChigger » 29 May 2008 20:15

KJA in an email dated Sat, 21 Oct 2006 14:50 -0400 (EDT) wrote:
SandChigger in previous email wrote:...how to reconcile the differences, in story terms, in the depictions of how Leto and Jessica came to be together? Did Frank include any sort of explanation? Or did he intend to go back and change the original passage in later editions of "Dune". (I guess this is the main question for this message.)

Frank wrote the dramatic scene (of Jessica being brought to Castle Caladan and a suspicious Duke Leto putting the knife to her throat) many years after the publication of DUNE. From my reading of the notes and files, it seems likely that Frank wrote that scene when he was working with David Lynch to flesh out the character background. Since we assume he knew what he was doing, and since it was a great scene, that is how we depicted it in House Atreides.

Without rereading the whole novel to answer your question (see the "I don't have the time!" paragraph above), only one sentence in the whole novel DUNE deals with how Jessica and Leto came together -- "Not since the day when the Duke's buyers had taken her from the school had she felt this frightened and unsure of herself." So, "the Duke's buyers had taken her from the school" ... Frank contradicted nine words out of a 195,000 word novel? If that's what gives you heartburn and keeps you up at night, then I'm sorry, my friend, but you need to get a life! <g> And if including that never-before-published scene, written by Frank himself, turns you off to our entire series of prequels, that just seems unreasonable to me. (Sorry if that sounds snippy, but it's very frustrating for me after all the incredible work and sweat and attention we put into writing these novels for somebody to nitpick about something so inconsequential.)
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Postby orald » 29 May 2008 20:21

Hiker Hack wrote:(Sorry if that sounds snippy, but it's very frustrating for me after all the incredible work and sweat and attention we put into writing these novels for somebody to nitpick about something so inconsequential.)

Yea, shame on you, Chig, those poor secreteries worked alot to type all that! :(
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Postby SandChigger » 29 May 2008 20:33

Aw...COME FUCK ME KEVIN!

(He probably won't notice Hype on my back and will give her the gritty grinding instead! :lol: )
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Re: FROM THE HACK HIMSELF

Postby Nekhrun » 29 May 2008 20:39

SandChigger wrote:
KJA in an email dated Sat, 21 Oct 2006 14:50 -0400 (EDT) wrote:...but it's very frustrating for me after all the incredible work and sweat and attention we put into writing these novels for somebody to nitpick about something so inconsequential.)

What an ass.

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Re: FROM THE HACK HIMSELF

Postby SandChigger » 29 May 2008 20:54

Nekhrun wrote:What an ass.

Why...thank you, I think.... :shock:

Oh...you meant KEVIN! :oops:
"Let the dead give water to the dead. As for me, it's NO MORE FUCKING TEARS!"

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Re: FROM THE HACK HIMSELF

Postby SimonH » 29 May 2008 22:08

SandChigger wrote:
KJA in an email dated Sat, 21 Oct 2006 14:50 -0400 (EDT) wrote:
SandChigger in previous email wrote:...how to reconcile the differences, in story terms, in the depictions of how Leto and Jessica came to be together? Did Frank include any sort of explanation? Or did he intend to go back and change the original passage in later editions of "Dune". (I guess this is the main question for this message.)

Frank wrote the dramatic scene (of Jessica being brought to Castle Caladan and a suspicious Duke Leto putting the knife to her throat) many years after the publication of DUNE. From my reading of the notes and files, it seems likely that Frank wrote that scene when he was working with David Lynch to flesh out the character background. Since we assume he knew what he was doing, and since it was a great scene, that is how we depicted it in House Atreides.

Without rereading the whole novel to answer your question (see the "I don't have the time!" paragraph above), only one sentence in the whole novel DUNE deals with how Jessica and Leto came together -- "Not since the day when the Duke's buyers had taken her from the school had she felt this frightened and unsure of herself." So, "the Duke's buyers had taken her from the school" ... Frank contradicted nine words out of a 195,000 word novel? If that's what gives you heartburn and keeps you up at night, then I'm sorry, my friend, but you need to get a life! <g> And if including that never-before-published scene, written by Frank himself, turns you off to our entire series of prequels, that just seems unreasonable to me. (Sorry if that sounds snippy, but it's very frustrating for me after all the incredible work and sweat and attention we put into writing these novels for somebody to nitpick about something so inconsequential.)


hey SandChigger - sounds like you have some great stuff from your emails with KJA - how about posting them in entirety on a thread? Or at least the bits of interest. I'm actually surprised how much of a tool he comes across as.

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Postby Dune Nerd » 29 May 2008 22:16

^^^^^
I second that notion.

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Postby SandChigger » 30 May 2008 01:10

Ooooh, come closer into my web, my pretties.....

Oh, wait, wrong persona. :oops:

One must dole out one's treasures sparingly. :D

(I've thought about it, believe me. ;) )
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Postby Serkanner » 06 Oct 2008 12:22

I am reading parts of Road to Dune and remembered the Hacks defending the Jessica scene and that it is canon because it was written by Frank ... but in Road to Dune it is stated that:

The following chapters were cut in this fashion and then never re­stored when the novel was published in book form. In one passage here, Frank Herbert mentions that spice has been used for only about a
century, but in later versions, he expands the time frame to span many thousands of years. Many details are inconsistent with the published versions, and these scenes should be considered drafts, not "canon."


... bye bye.
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and wrote a Dune Novel."

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on KJA and the bicth

Postby Sole Man » 06 Oct 2008 15:37

So they're inconsitent even with themsevels.

Hurm...

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Postby Freakzilla » 06 Oct 2008 15:40

I believe it was Abe Lincoln who said, "If you always tell the truth, you never have to remember what you said." Or something like that.
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Re: More FAQ Bull

Postby dunaddict » 06 Oct 2008 18:38

Q: In the preludes Jessica is almost forced on Duke Leto. Yet in the DUNE classic, we read that the Duke actually sent buyers to purchase her.

A: The Leto/Jessica meeting scene in HOUSE HARKONNEN was actually written by Frank Herbert himself and found in his notes. The events shown in HOUSE HARKONNEN are consistent with the original notes.


I just love how they don't even answer the original question. Who cares if the scene is consistent with some random note; It has to be consistent with DUNE, you know, that book you might have heard of?
The fact that this FAQ even suggests that consistency with the notes is more important, proves these people are incompetent or don't care enough about Dune to be allowed anywhere near the material.

I am reading parts of Road to Dune and remembered the Hacks defending the Jessica scene and that it is canon because it was written by Frank ... but in Road to Dune it is stated that:

The following chapters were cut in this fashion and then never re­stored when the novel was published in book form. In one passage here, Frank Herbert mentions that spice has been used for only about a
century, but in later versions, he expands the time frame to span many thousands of years. Many details are inconsistent with the published versions, and these scenes should be considered drafts, not "canon."


Oh, now I understand! The prequels should be considered drafts, not "canon". That explains the bad writing.... :twisted:

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Postby Raveem » 13 Oct 2008 12:14

Er, why are we trying to find a functioning chartered accountant in an ameoba tank?

Raveem.

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Postby DuneFishUK » 13 Oct 2008 12:52

Raveem wrote:Er, why are we trying to find a functioning chartered accountant in an ameoba tank?

Raveem.


I don't see any amoebas writing crap dune books - because amoebas are decent people.

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Re: More FAQ Bull

Postby chanilover » 13 Oct 2008 15:40

dunaddict wrote:
Q: In the preludes Jessica is almost forced on Duke Leto. Yet in the DUNE classic, we read that the Duke actually sent buyers to purchase her.

A: The Leto/Jessica meeting scene in HOUSE HARKONNEN was actually written by Frank Herbert himself and found in his notes. The events shown in HOUSE HARKONNEN are consistent with the original notes.


I just love how they don't even answer the original question. Who cares if the scene is consistent with some random note; It has to be consistent with DUNE, you know, that book you might have heard of?
The fact that this FAQ even suggests that consistency with the notes is more important, proves these people are incompetent or don't care enough about Dune to be allowed anywhere near the material.

I am reading parts of Road to Dune and remembered the Hacks defending the Jessica scene and that it is canon because it was written by Frank ... but in Road to Dune it is stated that:

The following chapters were cut in this fashion and then never re­stored when the novel was published in book form. In one passage here, Frank Herbert mentions that spice has been used for only about a
century, but in later versions, he expands the time frame to span many thousands of years. Many details are inconsistent with the published versions, and these scenes should be considered drafts, not "canon."


Oh, now I understand! The prequels should be considered drafts, not "canon". That explains the bad writing.... :twisted:


No, the bad writing is explained by a lack of talent which will stun the ages to come.
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