WTF is this?

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Ampoliros
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WTF is this?

Postby Ampoliros » 05 Mar 2009 00:30

Semper Fidelis Tyrannosaurus

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GamePlayer
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Postby GamePlayer » 05 Mar 2009 00:37

I don't see his "exploding head" quote. It's his best ever, after his admission of inadequacy following his bash of Banks (see Chig's sig) :)
"They can chew you up, but they gotta spit you out."

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TheDukester
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Postby TheDukester » 05 Mar 2009 01:26

"I mean, I wasn't stupid. I knew we'd make money and sell a lot of Dune books."

— KJA, answering the question: "Hey, Kevvie, what's your favorite part about using the HLP as your personal bitch?"
"Anything I write will be remembered and listed in bibliographies on Dune for several hundred years ..." — some delusional halfwit troll.

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A Thing of Eternity
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Postby A Thing of Eternity » 05 Mar 2009 01:31

Haha, when I was sockpuppeting as Ultraspice over at DN, my signature was from that site:

I don't think the author should make the reader do that much work to remember who somebody is.
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SandChigger
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Postby SandChigger » 05 Mar 2009 01:54

My personal favorites:

Over the years, I've trained myself to speak using the same language I would use if I were typing: meaning using full sentences in the way that paragraphs and scenes are arranged.

I wonder if this leads into the "perfect prose" quote? I've never been able to find it again...

Telling your story out loud is the way human beings communicate. We don't normally think up words, translate how to spell them and then move our fingers up and down over this randomly arranged set of keys to make the same letters appear on a screen.

Kevin on the human language capacity. :roll:

Stupid asshat pickle fucker. :roll:
"Let the dead give water to the dead. As for me, it's NO MORE FUCKING TEARS!"

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A Thing of Eternity
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Postby A Thing of Eternity » 05 Mar 2009 03:26

I've often thought of setting up a mic and just talking to myself to pound out ideas, or rough in scenes. I tend to talk to myself about this stuff anyways, I just never record it and much gets lost. I think the concept has merit. However, KJA kills the execution by dictating not just roughed in scenes, dialogue or setting, but by actually trying to dictate the prose itself, and then making someone else type it all out for him. That's probably a big part of why it all comes off in such atrocious language, with terribly broken grammar.
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Postby Schu » 05 Mar 2009 07:39

Each book will have a lot of cliffhangers, because I like that.

Another example of the "wouldn't it be cool if" principle.
I've had the same, full-time assistant and typist for eight or nine years now. She's read everything I've written, she types everything and does a good job, translates it and makes comments.

From retard to pretard?
If you had an alien race that looked like insects, then they would build robots to look like themselves, not to look like people.

Does this guy realise that most of our robots are entirely functional and look nothing like humans?
Of course you don't make any noise in space, because there's no air.

Glad to see that keen grasp of complicated science there...
Telling your story out loud is the way human beings communicate. We don't normally think up words, translate how to spell them and then move our fingers up and down over this randomly arranged set of keys to make the same letters appear on a screen.

We get it, you're illiterate.
We sat around on a hotel balcony with a bottle of wine and tried to figure out how you would go about blowing up a planet. That's the kind of conversations science fiction writers have when they get together. We don't talk about football or anything like that.

FH's account of what he and his buddies talk about in Road to Dune in the letters about Dune before publication makes him seem about 50 times less boring than you.
Wouldn't you like to have an augmented memory chip that you could plug into your head so you don't have to look everything up and remember everything?

Well, there's no substitute for error-checking. Most of us can remember the bits of FH's work you contradict though.

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Postby Nekhrun » 05 Mar 2009 08:13

When you start taking his quotes in small bits like that he looks even worse.

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Postby TheDukester » 05 Mar 2009 11:28

I really don't think the whole hiking-and-dictating serves some sort of noble story-telling or narrative tradition. That's giving an asshole like KJA way too much credit.

No, here's the purpose it serves: it's fast.

Dictation goes to the assistant, typed pages are returned to Kevvie, who glances at them briefly and then moves on. That's how you produce one "Dune" book per year ... that's how you cement a reputation as one of the quickest hacks-for-hire in the business.

It's important to remember that KJA has decided that his legacy will live forever due to sheer volume. He might not be a "critical darling," but, by God, he is going to crank out the prose until there's so much stuff that he just has to be mentioned when people talk about SF legends. It's all part of his screwed-up psyche and his twisted self-image, and it shines through like a beacon in just about every interview he's ever done.

Hiking-and-talking equals fast. End of story.
"Anything I write will be remembered and listed in bibliographies on Dune for several hundred years ..." — some delusional halfwit troll.

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Postby Schu » 05 Mar 2009 11:33

There's nothing wrong with the hike/dictate method except that it tempts one to do too little editing and proof-reading.

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Postby Freakzilla » 05 Mar 2009 11:34

A Thing of Eternity wrote:I've often thought of setting up a mic and just talking to myself to pound out ideas, or rough in scenes. I tend to talk to myself about this stuff anyways, I just never record it and much gets lost. I think the concept has merit. However, KJA kills the execution by dictating not just roughed in scenes, dialogue or setting, but by actually trying to dictate the prose itself, and then making someone else type it all out for him. That's probably a big part of why it all comes off in such atrocious language, with terribly broken grammar.


A group of my friends and I used to do that on LSD, we'd "write" SF stories. They never sounded as good the next day. BUt it does help to talk it out, especially with several people.
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Postby TheDukester » 05 Mar 2009 11:41

Schu wrote:There's nothing wrong with the hike/dictate method ...

I'd argue that.

Given the evidence in front of us — alleged "Dune" books that are complete and utter shit — I'd say there's plenty wrong with it.

Dictation, a full-time typist, "editing" that is an insult to the concept ... they're all just shortcuts to rush yet another KJA volume into print. For an alleged "writer," Kevvie actually does very little writing when you stop and think about it.
"Anything I write will be remembered and listed in bibliographies on Dune for several hundred years ..." — some delusional halfwit troll.

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Postby TheDukester » 05 Mar 2009 11:49

SandChigger wrote:I wonder if this leads into the "perfect prose" quote? I've never been able to find it again...

Same here. I just wasted another 15 minutes looking for it.

I wonder if it's being mis-remembered somehow? Maybe the wording of Kevvie's claim wasn't exactly "perfect prose"? Or maybe a third word appeared between the other two?

Argh! If anyone finds this KJA quote, be sure to post a link.
"Anything I write will be remembered and listed in bibliographies on Dune for several hundred years ..." — some delusional halfwit troll.

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Postby Ampoliros » 05 Mar 2009 12:20

Baraka Bryan wrote:could explain some of the repetition too... he's losing a train of thought but has to keep the prose going so he repeats something he said 5 minutes ago :P


Repetition and restatement are time honored tools of oral tradition. Also, tying certain specific adjectives to specific characters "Doe-eyed Hera" etc.

Now perhaps KJA was trying to create an oral storytelling genre for sci-fi, he might be on to something. All he would need then is imagination and a spark of originality.
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Postby Freakzilla » 05 Mar 2009 12:39

He's just parroting FH, who said he wrote orally, especially Dune. But at least Frank did his own typing afterwards.
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Postby Schu » 05 Mar 2009 12:58

TheDukester wrote:
Schu wrote:There's nothing wrong with the hike/dictate method ...

I'd argue that.

Given the evidence in front of us — alleged "Dune" books that are complete and utter shit — I'd say there's plenty wrong with it.

Dictation, a full-time typist, "editing" that is an insult to the concept ... they're all just shortcuts to rush yet another KJA volume into print. For an alleged "writer," Kevvie actually does very little writing when you stop and think about it.


There's absolutely nothing wrong with the idea of dictating your ideas to a tape recorder for later retrieval. The only things that are wrong with it are the way KJA applies the idea. He seems to treat it as an efficiency thing, where it should be a convenience/opportunity thing. It should be treated as a convenient way to take notes quickly and deal with them later, when you're doing some recreational activity that pretty much precludes actual note-taking. KJA treats it as a way to get as much written crap out of his time as possible instead, not even bothering to write up his own notes, and getting a friggin secretary to do it instead.

The idea is not at fault, only the application.

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Postby Omphalos » 05 Mar 2009 13:35

Schu wrote:There's nothing wrong with the hike/dictate method except that it tempts one to do too little editing and proof-reading.


Its too hard to work with a nice window in front of you, much less an actual panoramic vista. Ideas get diluted when you have something else to concentrate on. Tell me you'd even be able to concentrate if someone were reading Dune to you on a hike, much less trying to write a Dune book.

Failure to edit properly is something that happens later. When he's hiking he cant keep his mind on teh story or the elements of it, so what he comes up with is watered down, second-thought shit.

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Postby SandChigger » 05 Mar 2009 16:36

That's probably why he hikes so much with his brother-in-law: so the other guy can keep him from walking off a cliff or something when he's lost in his creativity.

Damn. :twisted:

I'm pretty sure I saw the "perfect prose" comment over on TheKJA's MySpace blog, probably in the comments. With the sucky software over there, you'd have to go back through all his posts to find it.

And I wouldn't put it past him to have edited or deleted it. ;)

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Postby Freakzilla » 05 Mar 2009 16:52

Omphalos wrote:
Schu wrote:There's nothing wrong with the hike/dictate method except that it tempts one to do too little editing and proof-reading.


Its too hard to work with a nice window in front of you, much less an actual panoramic vista. Ideas get diluted when you have something else to concentrate on. Tell me you'd even be able to concentrate if someone were reading Dune to you on a hike, much less trying to write a Dune book.

Failure to edit properly is something that happens later. When he's hiking he cant keep his mind on teh story or the elements of it, so what he comes up with is watered down, second-thought shit.


That is why I am CUBE MONKEY NUMBER 1!!! :P
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Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
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